Should Parsis promote funeral alternatives?

The discovery of a desiccated human body part in the garden of a fire temple on Napean Sea Road last week caused a lot of distress and deliberation among the city’s Parsi-Zoroastrians.

By Manoj Nair |DNA India

The Malabar Hill police suspect that the body part must have been picked up by a scavenger bird from the nearby Towers of Silence cemetery. But the incident has revived an old debate on whether the community should also promote alternate methods of funerals for their dead.

For centuries, the Parsi-Zoroastrians of Mumbai have left bodies of their dead at the hill-top cemetery for disposal by vultures and the sun. The near extinction of large scavenger birds, largely blamed on the use of certain painkilling drugs on cattle, has resulted in a crisis at the cemetery. To augment this ancient funeral method brought by their ancestors from Persia, community trusts have set up sun-powered devices at the cemetery to dispose of the bodies. But some feel the solar desiccators are not the answer.

Police have sent the body part to a forensic laboratory for testing and while the final report will have some information on its origin, supporters of the old funeral tradition say it is working well and has the acceptance from the overwhelming majority in the community. But groups campaigning for alternate funeral practices have quickly used the incident to promote their cause.

They say that though 10% to 12% of funerals in the community are already done in a non-traditional way, orthodox groups have refused community facilities and services for families of those who have opted for such rites.

More than a decade ago, a group called Disposal of the Dead with Dignity Action Group was formed by eminent members of the community to promote cremations and burials. The DDD is now defunct but there are other groups, like the Association for Revival of Zoroastrianism, which continue to campaign for alternate funerals.

On an average, two or three bodies are left at the towers every day, but in the absence of vultures and other large scavenging birds, the old system’s effectiveness has been put to test.

“The issue is not whether a bird has picked up a body part from the cemetery. The question we have raised is: why has this taken place? This has happened because the traditional system has collapsed without vultures. We need to look at cremations as an alternative,” said Vispy Wadia of ARZ.

Khojeste Mistree, trustee of the Bombay Parsi Punchayet, which manages the Towers of Silence, said though the cemetery has existed for over 300 years, this is the first time such an incident has been reported.

“Suddenly, this is found,” said Mistree. “It could have come from anywhere; there are two crematoriums in the vicinity. This is a sensitive issue; people are trying to restart a controversy. The system is working well and there has been no controversy for the last two-three years. Why resurrect it?”

  • Rashna

    Two Crematoriums in the vicinity, may we have addresses of such crematoriums in and around Malabar Hill, ?
    A supposedly responsible person (a Trustee is supposed to be responsible) should have pondered before shooting from his mouth this sentence. In cremation the full corpse is consumed and they do not cut the body and burn it. So even if there were a cremation ground in the nearby vicinity, a human palm could not  ended up in Godrej Baug.. What leaves Parsees like me disgusted is  that instead of attending the matter like a statesman as a Trustee of  largest Parsee  Trust, this Trustee seems to be talking utter rubbish and if other communities mock at us, is it a matter of any surprise?.

  • Rashna

    Two Crematoriums in the vicinity, may we have addresses of such crematoriums in and around Malabar Hill, ?
    A supposedly responsible person (a Trustee is supposed to be responsible) should have pondered before shooting from his mouth this sentence. In cremation the full corpse is consumed and they do not cut the body and burn it. So even if there were a cremation ground in the nearby vicinity, a human palm could not  ended up in Godrej Baug.. What leaves Parsees like me disgusted is  that instead of attending the matter like a statesman as a Trustee of  largest Parsee  Trust, this Trustee seems to be talking utter rubbish and if other communities mock at us, is it a matter of any surprise?.

  • http://www.facebook.com/rudvadia Rumi Udvadia

    It is high time and v should think of coming out of pre-history

  • http://www.facebook.com/rudvadia Rumi Udvadia

    It is high time and v should think of coming out of pre-history

  • Piloomani

    The time tested funeral system of Dokhmenshi is now obsolete and should be discarded.  There was a time when it had its uses.  Parsi Community have changed many of its ancient customs to suit modern way of life.  Why cling to this particular system of funeral, when it is not working.  The BPP can start a burial system at the Towers of Silence. This system is followed by the original and resilient Zoroastrian community in Yazad.  There is ample space for the burial system at Doongerwadi.  What is the need to follow this practice?  Do the BPP and Parsi High Priest feel that by just following this practice the Ruvan will go to heaven?  Does this mean that people who do not follow it i.e. Parsis in Iran or America will go to hell.  BPP and Parsi High Priest should realise that your deeds are more important in life than Dokhmenshi to go to Heaven.  Many influential Parsis (Industrialists) have lead a life where they have heaped injustices and deprived middle class Parsis of things which they should have lawfully got.  Influential members (Trustees and Secretaries of Societies) have filed unjust and uncalled for legal cases using on middle class tenants just to harass them, using the Trust money where the tenants have to shell out from their own pockets.  Does it mean that just by following Dokhmenshi these people will be able to wipe off their sins.  The Parsi community is full of anomalies where influence and money power only counts.  If you do not have influence or money power you do not count.  The system of Solar Panels is just of way of making money for certain individuals and Trustees. In summary, I request the BPP and Parsi High Priests to stop the practice of Dokhmenshi and start burials at Doongerwadi as done on Yazad, Iran.

  • Piloomani

    The time tested funeral system of Dokhmenshi is now obsolete and should be discarded.  There was a time when it had its uses.  Parsi Community have changed many of its ancient customs to suit modern way of life.  Why cling to this particular system of funeral, when it is not working.  The BPP can start a burial system at the Towers of Silence. This system is followed by the original and resilient Zoroastrian community in Yazad.  There is ample space for the burial system at Doongerwadi.  What is the need to follow this practice?  Do the BPP and Parsi High Priest feel that by just following this practice the Ruvan will go to heaven?  Does this mean that people who do not follow it i.e. Parsis in Iran or America will go to hell.  BPP and Parsi High Priest should realise that your deeds are more important in life than Dokhmenshi to go to Heaven.  Many influential Parsis (Industrialists) have lead a life where they have heaped injustices and deprived middle class Parsis of things which they should have lawfully got.  Influential members (Trustees and Secretaries of Societies) have filed unjust and uncalled for legal cases using on middle class tenants just to harass them, using the Trust money where the tenants have to shell out from their own pockets.  Does it mean that just by following Dokhmenshi these people will be able to wipe off their sins.  The Parsi community is full of anomalies where influence and money power only counts.  If you do not have influence or money power you do not count.  The system of Solar Panels is just of way of making money for certain individuals and Trustees. In summary, I request the BPP and Parsi High Priests to stop the practice of Dokhmenshi and start burials at Doongerwadi as done on Yazad, Iran.

  • phiroze

    What is the need to have crematoria in and around Malabar Hill only?. What leaves Parsses like me disgusted is this insistance of having one at the Doongerwadi complex inspite of them being available all over Mumbai. Do Parsees like you have a problem with Government provided crematoriums which are also used by other communities?????? Do not forget that Godrej Baug is within the Doongerwadi Complex. The system has not failed but supposedly forward thinking Parsis like you have failed the system. 

  • phiroze

    What is the need to have crematoria in and around Malabar Hill only?. What leaves Parsses like me disgusted is this insistance of having one at the Doongerwadi complex inspite of them being available all over Mumbai. Do Parsees like you have a problem with Government provided crematoriums which are also used by other communities?????? Do not forget that Godrej Baug is within the Doongerwadi Complex. The system has not failed but supposedly forward thinking Parsis like you have failed the system. 

  • Burjor

    As long as the systems at the Doongerwadi are working satisfactorily, obviously there is no need for a change. But if they are not then it is time we seriously need to think of alternate means. And the next best alternate means seems to be burial which as things stand is practiced all over the World where the Towers of Silence do not exist for the past several centuries. 
    Even in Bombay, at periodical intervals the bodies are removed from the wells and buried in a Bhandar. So the practice of burial does exist in Bombay also. The only difference would be instead of burial occuring after a few months would take place at the time of death after the Pydast. We have the vast lands which could be put the proper use, before they are acquired by unscrupulous powerful Govt. officials who could take advantage of our miniscule numbers and weakness.

  • Burjor

    As long as the systems at the Doongerwadi are working satisfactorily, obviously there is no need for a change. But if they are not then it is time we seriously need to think of alternate means. And the next best alternate means seems to be burial which as things stand is practiced all over the World where the Towers of Silence do not exist for the past several centuries. 
    Even in Bombay, at periodical intervals the bodies are removed from the wells and buried in a Bhandar. So the practice of burial does exist in Bombay also. The only difference would be instead of burial occuring after a few months would take place at the time of death after the Pydast. We have the vast lands which could be put the proper use, before they are acquired by unscrupulous powerful Govt. officials who could take advantage of our miniscule numbers and weakness.

  • A. Rustomjee

    I
    am simply left speechless literally on reading what level  a  B.P.P.
    Trustee can stoop to after reading his reaction.Have elected such ‘intelligent’
    persons as Trustees who take for granted the intellectual level of an average
    Parsi but  go to the extent of assuming that members of other communities
    too would  consider his ‘surmises’ as plausible. Any case, he was not only
    economising on facts but was palpably misleading the member of the fourth
    estate. Does Parsee community really deserve this type of a Trustee or is it
    the ‘fruit’ of adult franchise which an educated community frittered away
    listening to the miasma of distortion that DEEN WAS ENDANGERED.. Now my Deen is
    seriously endangered by such Trustee material badly needing to be treated on a
    Sofa of a shrink.

      

  • A. Rustomjee

    I
    am simply left speechless literally on reading what level  a  B.P.P.
    Trustee can stoop to after reading his reaction.Have elected such ‘intelligent’
    persons as Trustees who take for granted the intellectual level of an average
    Parsi but  go to the extent of assuming that members of other communities
    too would  consider his ‘surmises’ as plausible. Any case, he was not only
    economising on facts but was palpably misleading the member of the fourth
    estate. Does Parsee community really deserve this type of a Trustee or is it
    the ‘fruit’ of adult franchise which an educated community frittered away
    listening to the miasma of distortion that DEEN WAS ENDANGERED.. Now my Deen is
    seriously endangered by such Trustee material badly needing to be treated on a
    Sofa of a shrink.

      

  • Rashna.

    Phiroze: O.K. to use your own words it is we ‘supposedly forward thinking Parsis like you have failed the system.’ Assuming but not conceding your premise to be correct, two conclusions emerge.
    Firstly, can you reply what you and your tribe of  ‘supposedly BACKWARD THINKING PARSIS HAVE DONE TO BOLSTER THE FAILED SYSTEM”?Secondly, glad to know that you too concur that there is failure some where.
    Thirdly show me the sentence of my earlier  comment where I have suggested setting up Crematorium at Doongerwadi.? You are hallucinating.Mr. Phiroze.just as you hallucinate that the current failed custom is “working’. Take my advice- WAKE UP TO REALITIES.
    All the different persons above who have commented have suggested burial as an option and they represent the voice  that  common non bigoted, non fundamentalist Parsee expresses.  unlike you who expect every Parsee to share your misconceived faith in the custom which has nothing to do with our Religion.

  • Adarbahman

    I do not find a single post /comment from remaining five comments suggesting setting up crematorium at Towers of Silence. Yes, there are suggestions for burials.Needless to add that this prime land is a a place of resting and there is no reason to discriminate  between  Parse Zoroastrians on the basis of how the copse has been disposed off. Persons like Phiroz will leave no stone unturned to  obfuscate the issue. If persons do not want to admit the writings on the wall, it is their problem. It is of little consequence to indulge in blame game. Nature has taken its toll. Most Parsees are agitated and annoyed not only by the incident but by the way a Trustee has made absolutely silly utterances instead of acting in a responsible manner.
    In fact, I would oppose setting up of crematorium at the same place but that does not mean that current state of affairs has no problems.Let us all be realistic and work for a better system to support the existing one, so that both can compliment and supplement each other.
    Better course would be for Athornan Mandal to pass instructions to all Fire Temple Panthakis to perform all obsequies regardless of mode of disposal or place where the deceased breathed his last.For are not Mumbai Fire Temples performing all first four days ceremonies of those who are cremated say in Canada, U.S. etc?

  • Adarbahman

    I do not find a single post /comment from remaining five comments suggesting setting up crematorium at Towers of Silence. Yes, there are suggestions for burials.Needless to add that this prime land is a a place of resting and there is no reason to discriminate  between  Parse Zoroastrians on the basis of how the copse has been disposed off. Persons like Phiroz will leave no stone unturned to  obfuscate the issue. If persons do not want to admit the writings on the wall, it is their problem. It is of little consequence to indulge in blame game. Nature has taken its toll. Most Parsees are agitated and annoyed not only by the incident but by the way a Trustee has made absolutely silly utterances instead of acting in a responsible manner.
    In fact, I would oppose setting up of crematorium at the same place but that does not mean that current state of affairs has no problems.Let us all be realistic and work for a better system to support the existing one, so that both can compliment and supplement each other.
    Better course would be for Athornan Mandal to pass instructions to all Fire Temple Panthakis to perform all obsequies regardless of mode of disposal or place where the deceased breathed his last.For are not Mumbai Fire Temples performing all first four days ceremonies of those who are cremated say in Canada, U.S. etc?

  • Mobed.Shaimak.

    Despite all opinions expressed here-above, Phiroze expects that his ‘conclusion’ is most reliable. Why? He alone knows.I do not find any person commenting above mentioning setting up of Cremation grounds at Doongerwadi but as is his habit Phiroze wants to confuse issues to raise passions and emotions. Not every person thinks from angle of emotions but use their common sense. Except for Tibet, which is a tableland with abundant green cover, nowhere else the is this practice of exposue to sunlight and allowing decaying of naked corpses practised. So if one goes by what Phiroze says, all the world is wrong and he alone is right.
    True that crematorias exists in the City but if all use Municipal Cremation grounds, will not Doongerwadi  land be open to encroachments and even  take over?. Sensible thing to do would be to allow recitation of funery prayers at the Towers  but the choice of disposal being left to the discretion of the deceased and his close relatives. It is the imposition of fatwa of not allowing offering of prayers for those who choose other means of disposal that is causing heartburn .Whatever Phiroze and persons like him say the method as it was in earlier times has FAILED and imposing the same by means of blackmail in form of denial of sacraments is a heinous sin. There is nothing like forward or backward thinking Parsis. People infer and conclude based on what they observe and not what was told to them by persons of  earlier three or two generations.

  • Mobed.Shaimak.

    Despite all opinions expressed here-above, Phiroze expects that his ‘conclusion’ is most reliable. Why? He alone knows.I do not find any person commenting above mentioning setting up of Cremation grounds at Doongerwadi but as is his habit Phiroze wants to confuse issues to raise passions and emotions. Not every person thinks from angle of emotions but use their common sense. Except for Tibet, which is a tableland with abundant green cover, nowhere else the is this practice of exposue to sunlight and allowing decaying of naked corpses practised. So if one goes by what Phiroze says, all the world is wrong and he alone is right.
    True that crematorias exists in the City but if all use Municipal Cremation grounds, will not Doongerwadi  land be open to encroachments and even  take over?. Sensible thing to do would be to allow recitation of funery prayers at the Towers  but the choice of disposal being left to the discretion of the deceased and his close relatives. It is the imposition of fatwa of not allowing offering of prayers for those who choose other means of disposal that is causing heartburn .Whatever Phiroze and persons like him say the method as it was in earlier times has FAILED and imposing the same by means of blackmail in form of denial of sacraments is a heinous sin. There is nothing like forward or backward thinking Parsis. People infer and conclude based on what they observe and not what was told to them by persons of  earlier three or two generations.

  • Rathestar.

    Who has asked for setting up cremation facilities at the Doongerwadi. ? Phiroze seems to be trying to deliberately trying to create chaos. It is the insensitive and senseless remark of a sitting Trustee that has put the full community to acute embarassment. A Trustee who had stated that such a palm could have come from a crematorium elsewhere. Does he not know that in Cremation, the mourners carry the ashes of the dead and do not separate. body parts?
    One can not mislead the entire community every time and Religiousness is not the virtue of only those who swear by the failed system.

  • Rathestar.

    Who has asked for setting up cremation facilities at the Doongerwadi. ? Phiroze seems to be trying to deliberately trying to create chaos. It is the insensitive and senseless remark of a sitting Trustee that has put the full community to acute embarassment. A Trustee who had stated that such a palm could have come from a crematorium elsewhere. Does he not know that in Cremation, the mourners carry the ashes of the dead and do not separate. body parts?
    One can not mislead the entire community every time and Religiousness is not the virtue of only those who swear by the failed system.

  • Behroze

    TO OBFUSCATE IS THE HALLMARK OF ALL DHONGEES POSING AS BABAS, TEACHERS OF RELIGIONS, HAVE WE ALL NOT SEEM SUCH “SAINTS” ON CERTAIN T.V. CHANNELS. PREACH ONE THING PRACTICE ANOTHER.

  • Behroze

    TO OBFUSCATE IS THE HALLMARK OF ALL DHONGEES POSING AS BABAS, TEACHERS OF RELIGIONS, HAVE WE ALL NOT SEEM SUCH “SAINTS” ON CERTAIN T.V. CHANNELS. PREACH ONE THING PRACTICE ANOTHER.

  • Darius Khambatta

    How does it make a darn difference once a fellow is dead as to the “method” of disposal…the guys dead, he doesnt feel a thing. Now, coming on to the fact if the person is going to heaven or hell or whether hes going to be re-born as a human/a rat /an ass or a monkey will depend on if he did good in his lifetime..to this world and to his fellow human beings and all things that make up this world. SO, if he was a chor/makkar in his/her life no amount of doongerwadi prayers is going to help him/her.You r definitely getting back here as an ass.Also for the practical proof of my theory , the discerning public is urged to look around them at a few fellow community members …..these asses look like humans and walk on two leg’s…but they bray like donkeys.

  • Darius Khambatta

    How does it make a darn difference once a fellow is dead as to the “method” of disposal…the guys dead, he doesnt feel a thing. Now, coming on to the fact if the person is going to heaven or hell or whether hes going to be re-born as a human/a rat /an ass or a monkey will depend on if he did good in his lifetime..to this world and to his fellow human beings and all things that make up this world. SO, if he was a chor/makkar in his/her life no amount of doongerwadi prayers is going to help him/her.You r definitely getting back here as an ass.Also for the practical proof of my theory , the discerning public is urged to look around them at a few fellow community members …..these asses look like humans and walk on two leg’s…but they bray like donkeys.

  • Ronnie

    Its time for our progressive community to change our burial method which has ceased to be effective post disappearance of the vultures. Either we get the vultures back into service or we should move onto electric crematorium. A new electric crematorium on the doongerwadi premises exclusively for Parsis is what is required. The solar method will never work as it is only subjects the body to decay in open sunlight and is least effective during monsoons. Also bodies of parsis brought from areas outside of mumbai need permissions from malabar hill policer station even though permission has been received from their local police staton. Malabar Hill police station clearance is not required for bodies from within the mumbai region. This needs to be looked into and abolished by intervention of our emminent parsis like parsi punchayet trustees, etc.
    Its time for a change for the better!!!

  • Ronnie

    Its time for our progressive community to change our burial method which has ceased to be effective post disappearance of the vultures. Either we get the vultures back into service or we should move onto electric crematorium. A new electric crematorium on the doongerwadi premises exclusively for Parsis is what is required. The solar method will never work as it is only subjects the body to decay in open sunlight and is least effective during monsoons. Also bodies of parsis brought from areas outside of mumbai need permissions from malabar hill policer station even though permission has been received from their local police staton. Malabar Hill police station clearance is not required for bodies from within the mumbai region. This needs to be looked into and abolished by intervention of our emminent parsis like parsi punchayet trustees, etc.
    Its time for a change for the better!!!

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_PHV6RFVDEWPSYUFVQK4J3X7KNM rustom j

    Where all are we going to run to not strengthen zoroastrian systems. After all all systems have their pros and cons…Today any challenge faced by the community, their response is to change. So much that people feel that change is arbitrary and unconditional though Archimedes, Einsteins, newtons, etc etc do not change, the same way that the principles and science of decomposition do not change, like the thumb rule that EXPOSURE TO AIR is twice as FAST Than when in water and upto 8 times FASTER IN AIR than when buried. Deeper burials increase the decomposition time and also form  Adiasporce a chemical that further exagerates the decomposition time..thus we have space crunches all over europe and the reason for vertical burials where in the remains are given back to the relatives.Some people think crematoriums are the modern way without any problems..“A crematorium should not be sited close to a neighborhood.” — Dr. Veerle Willaeys, resident in community medicine, University of British Columbia “Crematoria should not be located in residential neighborhoods.” — Dr. Perry Kendall, chief medical health officer for British Columbia“Elemental (metallic) mercury primarily causes health effects when it is breathed as a vapor where it can be absorbed through the lungs.” — United States Environmental Protection Agency, 2008

    “[M]etallic mercury vapors are more harmful than other forms because more mercury in [this] form reaches the brain.” — United States Centers for Disease Control, 2005(The risk of stillbirth and some abnormalities may be slightly increased among babies of mothers living near incinerators and crematoria, suggests research by the University of Newcastle upon Tyne.The risk of stillbirth was 4% higher and the risk of the life threatening brain abnormality anencephalus was 5% higher among babies whose mothers lived near to crematoria. )
    From http://www.ejnet.org/crematori…Lets look at articles that show the dangers of Pacemakers exploding in crematoriums..Then we have the vast ecological damage done by mercury vapours released thru crematoriums due to dental fillings..The damage is sovast just by a single filling…and the whole ecological change is demaged..The bigger the fish in the food chain..the bigger the damage..According to the Cremation Association of North America’s (CANA) statistics, and assuming death rates in the county stay stable, Smith Funeral Home will be performing over 100 cremations per year by 2025, almost all of which will emit mercury from amalgam fillings.Poisoning from inhaled metallic mercury can occur after a chronic, low-level exposure. According to the report ”Poisoning from inhaled metallic mercury can occur after a chronic, low-level exposure. Three cardinal signs of this type of exposure are excitability (erethism), tremors, and gingivitis. Vaporized metallic mercury also can cause toxic effects to the nervous system, kidneys, cardiovascular system, gastrointestinal system, lungs, muscle, liver, blood cell count, skin and eyes, fertility, and immune system. The human fetus and small children are more likely to concentrate mercury in the developing brain and kidneys. Adults are affected less, but likewise can be poisoned over the long term”.From
    http://sites.google.com/site/g…Apart from thisThe average cremation causes 160kg of carbon dioxide per body being released into the atmosphere. Other pollutants include dioxins, carbon monoxide and nitrogen oxides.With cremation the casket containing the deceased is put into a furnace at a temperature of around 800 degrees Celsius.This intense heat causes the casket to ignite, once ignited an oil burner takes over. It then take an hour to combust. Once this is done, then the remains are grounded in a mill What about the filters then, how does one destroy the filters of the crematoria, they have their own HUGE pollutant aspect..Of course one can close eyes to that or be oblivious to science but in the name of modernityDokhmenishini is not in isolation from other Zoroastrian systems. It is linked to the making of an agiary and atashbehram, the various Yazads including Dahm which is invoked whilst doing a jashan at home and forms a basic foundations of Zoroastrianism. Ironically the ones wanting to revive Zoroastrianism, want to end its foundations, what wisdom is that, that makes one think that we can survive as zoroastrians and that Zoroastrianism can survive without its practices. Thats the reason the sikhs, Muslims, Jains set up their practices and foundations even in foreign lands. Thats the reason our ancestors took up the challenge to put in place Zoroastrian practices after taking refuge in India. It was also a challenge..a challenge that made them take on and fulfill with time, whilst we put in more energy to change with the bull that change is always necessary and always good.Another challenge undertaken was when the only and thr first time in the world a fire was transported in a plane to preserve the essence of an agiary….in the 70s when a consecrated fire was brought in by plane from Aden..what would have been the excuses not to by all the anti dokha ilk…again in the name of modernity….infact modernity was enhanced by that feat, the science, the know how of how to transport a live fire was found out. In the world vulture aviaries are doing well…….its been a decade , we would have at least ;earnt a few lessons apart from a slow yet sure moving towards success by now..for modernity’s sake..

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_PHV6RFVDEWPSYUFVQK4J3X7KNM rustom j

    Where all are we going to run to not strengthen zoroastrian systems. After all all systems have their pros and cons…Today any challenge faced by the community, their response is to change. So much that people feel that change is arbitrary and unconditional though Archimedes, Einsteins, newtons, etc etc do not change, the same way that the principles and science of decomposition do not change, like the thumb rule that EXPOSURE TO AIR is twice as FAST Than when in water and upto 8 times FASTER IN AIR than when buried. Deeper burials increase the decomposition time and also form  Adiasporce a chemical that further exagerates the decomposition time..thus we have space crunches all over europe and the reason for vertical burials where in the remains are given back to the relatives.Some people think crematoriums are the modern way without any problems..“A crematorium should not be sited close to a neighborhood.” — Dr. Veerle Willaeys, resident in community medicine, University of British Columbia “Crematoria should not be located in residential neighborhoods.” — Dr. Perry Kendall, chief medical health officer for British Columbia“Elemental (metallic) mercury primarily causes health effects when it is breathed as a vapor where it can be absorbed through the lungs.” — United States Environmental Protection Agency, 2008

    “[M]etallic mercury vapors are more harmful than other forms because more mercury in [this] form reaches the brain.” — United States Centers for Disease Control, 2005(The risk of stillbirth and some abnormalities may be slightly increased among babies of mothers living near incinerators and crematoria, suggests research by the University of Newcastle upon Tyne.The risk of stillbirth was 4% higher and the risk of the life threatening brain abnormality anencephalus was 5% higher among babies whose mothers lived near to crematoria. )
    From http://www.ejnet.org/crematori…Lets look at articles that show the dangers of Pacemakers exploding in crematoriums..Then we have the vast ecological damage done by mercury vapours released thru crematoriums due to dental fillings..The damage is sovast just by a single filling…and the whole ecological change is demaged..The bigger the fish in the food chain..the bigger the damage..According to the Cremation Association of North America’s (CANA) statistics, and assuming death rates in the county stay stable, Smith Funeral Home will be performing over 100 cremations per year by 2025, almost all of which will emit mercury from amalgam fillings.Poisoning from inhaled metallic mercury can occur after a chronic, low-level exposure. According to the report ”Poisoning from inhaled metallic mercury can occur after a chronic, low-level exposure. Three cardinal signs of this type of exposure are excitability (erethism), tremors, and gingivitis. Vaporized metallic mercury also can cause toxic effects to the nervous system, kidneys, cardiovascular system, gastrointestinal system, lungs, muscle, liver, blood cell count, skin and eyes, fertility, and immune system. The human fetus and small children are more likely to concentrate mercury in the developing brain and kidneys. Adults are affected less, but likewise can be poisoned over the long term”.From
    http://sites.google.com/site/g…Apart from thisThe average cremation causes 160kg of carbon dioxide per body being released into the atmosphere. Other pollutants include dioxins, carbon monoxide and nitrogen oxides.With cremation the casket containing the deceased is put into a furnace at a temperature of around 800 degrees Celsius.This intense heat causes the casket to ignite, once ignited an oil burner takes over. It then take an hour to combust. Once this is done, then the remains are grounded in a mill What about the filters then, how does one destroy the filters of the crematoria, they have their own HUGE pollutant aspect..Of course one can close eyes to that or be oblivious to science but in the name of modernityDokhmenishini is not in isolation from other Zoroastrian systems. It is linked to the making of an agiary and atashbehram, the various Yazads including Dahm which is invoked whilst doing a jashan at home and forms a basic foundations of Zoroastrianism. Ironically the ones wanting to revive Zoroastrianism, want to end its foundations, what wisdom is that, that makes one think that we can survive as zoroastrians and that Zoroastrianism can survive without its practices. Thats the reason the sikhs, Muslims, Jains set up their practices and foundations even in foreign lands. Thats the reason our ancestors took up the challenge to put in place Zoroastrian practices after taking refuge in India. It was also a challenge..a challenge that made them take on and fulfill with time, whilst we put in more energy to change with the bull that change is always necessary and always good.Another challenge undertaken was when the only and thr first time in the world a fire was transported in a plane to preserve the essence of an agiary….in the 70s when a consecrated fire was brought in by plane from Aden..what would have been the excuses not to by all the anti dokha ilk…again in the name of modernity….infact modernity was enhanced by that feat, the science, the know how of how to transport a live fire was found out. In the world vulture aviaries are doing well…….its been a decade , we would have at least ;earnt a few lessons apart from a slow yet sure moving towards success by now..for modernity’s sake..

  • sorab

     I think we should leave it to the individual to decide how he would like to be disposed off after he/she dies. Sticking to the old method in the name of religion even after  the vultures are  gone is downright dogmatic and should not be allowed in a democratic country.

  • sorab

     I think we should leave it to the individual to decide how he would like to be disposed off after he/she dies. Sticking to the old method in the name of religion even after  the vultures are  gone is downright dogmatic and should not be allowed in a democratic country.

  • Contradhongee

    Hi, Rustom,

    Contradhongee here. Remember me. How could you forget when I
    cannot forget your old song of strengthening the system . Well you said the
    same over  three years back. Now
    that  WAPIZ Trustees have been in  saddle for over three years , would you mind
    sharing with the community which is highly agitated about  the NATURE OF STEPS TAKEN DURING LAST THREE
    YEARS TO “STRENGTHEN  THE SYSTEM’. 

    No senseless homilies. Just point to point answer.

  • Contradhongee

    Hi, Rustom,

    Contradhongee here. Remember me. How could you forget when I
    cannot forget your old song of strengthening the system . Well you said the
    same over  three years back. Now
    that  WAPIZ Trustees have been in  saddle for over three years , would you mind
    sharing with the community which is highly agitated about  the NATURE OF STEPS TAKEN DURING LAST THREE
    YEARS TO “STRENGTHEN  THE SYSTEM’. 

    No senseless homilies. Just point to point answer.

  • Byram the Outspoken

    @54dba9775dc6518820f0855a1f077f36:disqus rustom: for a moment let us leave the controversy aside and let us now the address of two crematoriums referred to by Khoeste Mistree which are supposedly close by to Mumbai Doongerwadi.  Secondly, it would be pertinent to know if  you or the Messiah really know that Hindus amongst whom cremation is practised carry the ashes of the departed and the corpse is consigned as whole.
    Thirdly, since our community is too tiny and insignificant in size, the disadvantages of  our failed system are not recorded on Google or other websites relied upon by you. So absence of the same does not imply that our failed system is working.

    You seem to harbouring set assumptions about the other systems which have flaws.Science has made rapid strides and in places like Europe cremation with its own inherent drawbacks is being replaced by methods of chemical decomposition.
    Your reference to bringing Aden Fire to Mumbai is read but its relevance to current controversy is least understood because it has no relevance. It would do you a million good if you refer to positive aspects of new found methods of disposal of dead instead of bursting holes in other defective systems. The demerits of other existing methods does not mean that the failed system of Parsees is WORKING

  • Byram the Outspoken

    @54dba9775dc6518820f0855a1f077f36:disqus rustom: for a moment let us leave the controversy aside and let us now the address of two crematoriums referred to by Khoeste Mistree which are supposedly close by to Mumbai Doongerwadi.  Secondly, it would be pertinent to know if  you or the Messiah really know that Hindus amongst whom cremation is practised carry the ashes of the departed and the corpse is consigned as whole.
    Thirdly, since our community is too tiny and insignificant in size, the disadvantages of  our failed system are not recorded on Google or other websites relied upon by you. So absence of the same does not imply that our failed system is working.

    You seem to harbouring set assumptions about the other systems which have flaws.Science has made rapid strides and in places like Europe cremation with its own inherent drawbacks is being replaced by methods of chemical decomposition.
    Your reference to bringing Aden Fire to Mumbai is read but its relevance to current controversy is least understood because it has no relevance. It would do you a million good if you refer to positive aspects of new found methods of disposal of dead instead of bursting holes in other defective systems. The demerits of other existing methods does not mean that the failed system of Parsees is WORKING

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_PHV6RFVDEWPSYUFVQK4J3X7KNM rustom j

    Dhongee…i said that 3 years ago and ill say it again….that we need to strenghten zoroastrian systems if zoroastrianism has to survive….and that all systems have its pros and cons just like cremation and burials have…now as far as what the trustees have done well the propoganda againstt eh dokha and the aviary project was so hyped up that it could have been at a more advanced stage instead of contiuing to put t down..Had the community and the likes of you pushed for an aviary instead of always negating dokhmenishini, we would have got some..and in any case if the trustees have not done anything for it, one cannot discard the ill effects of the crematoria ot the fact that some people think that change is always good and compulsary when scientific principles do not change with time and also the notion that zoroastrian principles have to change according to a vote bank..cause if one changes zrchimededs or newtons laws based on democracy it wont remain the same just like zoroastrianism may just be something that zoroastra preached against. 
    Also another interesting fact that no one has forced any zoroastrian system on any one, people have the freedom to mock zoroastrian systems , after al, they were mocked by the byzantines, people have the freedom to NOT Follow zoroastrian systemns, but no one has the right to stop zoroastrian systems or change it and take away the freedom from those who want strengthen zoroastrian systems and the patience for it……and no one has the right to use foundations for zoroastrian principles given for free to use it for personal tastes and dislikes…i still ownder why the ant dokhma group havent founded their own crematoria..or do they want that for free too!!!

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_PHV6RFVDEWPSYUFVQK4J3X7KNM rustom j

    Dhongee…i said that 3 years ago and ill say it again….that we need to strenghten zoroastrian systems if zoroastrianism has to survive….and that all systems have its pros and cons just like cremation and burials have…now as far as what the trustees have done well the propoganda againstt eh dokha and the aviary project was so hyped up that it could have been at a more advanced stage instead of contiuing to put t down..Had the community and the likes of you pushed for an aviary instead of always negating dokhmenishini, we would have got some..and in any case if the trustees have not done anything for it, one cannot discard the ill effects of the crematoria ot the fact that some people think that change is always good and compulsary when scientific principles do not change with time and also the notion that zoroastrian principles have to change according to a vote bank..cause if one changes zrchimededs or newtons laws based on democracy it wont remain the same just like zoroastrianism may just be something that zoroastra preached against. 
    Also another interesting fact that no one has forced any zoroastrian system on any one, people have the freedom to mock zoroastrian systems , after al, they were mocked by the byzantines, people have the freedom to NOT Follow zoroastrian systemns, but no one has the right to stop zoroastrian systems or change it and take away the freedom from those who want strengthen zoroastrian systems and the patience for it……and no one has the right to use foundations for zoroastrian principles given for free to use it for personal tastes and dislikes…i still ownder why the ant dokhma group havent founded their own crematoria..or do they want that for free too!!!

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_PHV6RFVDEWPSYUFVQK4J3X7KNM rustom j

    Dhongee…i said that 3 years ago and ill say it again….that we need to strenghten zoroastrian systems if zoroastrianism has to survive….and that all systems have its pros and cons just like cremation and burials have…now as far as what the trustees have done well the propoganda againstt eh dokha and the aviary project was so hyped up that it could have been at a more advanced stage instead of contiuing to put t down..Had the community and the likes of you pushed for an aviary instead of always negating dokhmenishini, we would have got some..and in any case if the trustees have not done anything for it, one cannot discard the ill effects of the crematoria ot the fact that some people think that change is always good and compulsary when scientific principles do not change with time and also the notion that zoroastrian principles have to change according to a vote bank..cause if one changes zrchimededs or newtons laws based on democracy it wont remain the same just like zoroastrianism may just be something that zoroastra preached against. 
    Also another interesting fact that no one has forced any zoroastrian system on any one, people have the freedom to mock zoroastrian systems , after al, they were mocked by the byzantines, people have the freedom to NOT Follow zoroastrian systemns, but no one has the right to stop zoroastrian systems or change it and take away the freedom from those who want strengthen zoroastrian systems and the patience for it……and no one has the right to use foundations for zoroastrian principles given for free to use it for personal tastes and dislikes…i still ownder why the ant dokhma group havent founded their own crematoria..or do they want that for free too!!!

  • Farsak Ashli

    @yahoo-PHV6RFVDEWPSYUFVQK4J3X7KNM:disqus . By finding out faults of other systems,you can not refute that the Parsi system being practised  has not failed.That is as good as a Doctor saying to the patient suffering from type I Diabetes that there millions suffering from type II diabetes.I do not fathom the relevance of your reference to bringing Aden Fire Temple here to the failed method of disposal. I am not a reformist but a practical person relying on what I see with my own eyes and not on false propaganda of  land mafias eyeing the precious real estate one it is in state of disuse.
    Before ending, let me tell you that those claiming that the system has not failed are not one degree more devout Zoroastrians/ Parsees than those silent majority who believe otherwise and have to put up false fatwas of those who mix up custom with religious equations.

  • Farsak Ashli

    @yahoo-PHV6RFVDEWPSYUFVQK4J3X7KNM:disqus . By finding out faults of other systems,you can not refute that the Parsi system being practised  has not failed.That is as good as a Doctor saying to the patient suffering from type I Diabetes that there millions suffering from type II diabetes.I do not fathom the relevance of your reference to bringing Aden Fire Temple here to the failed method of disposal. I am not a reformist but a practical person relying on what I see with my own eyes and not on false propaganda of  land mafias eyeing the precious real estate one it is in state of disuse.
    Before ending, let me tell you that those claiming that the system has not failed are not one degree more devout Zoroastrians/ Parsees than those silent majority who believe otherwise and have to put up false fatwas of those who mix up custom with religious equations.

  • Darius Khambatta

    Dear Rus-tom-ji, i guess we should not mock the doongerwadi system.In this matter you are probably correct. HOW-ever the issue of discussion is that the problem starts when these “winged wonders”(vultures) start dropping human limbs all over the Metropolitan city of Mumbai. It tends to hurt the sensebilities of our fellow Indians,especially the vegetarians and the incident makes a mockery of the Parsees who as it is are seen as senile retards kind courtesy bollywood.

  • Darius Khambatta

    Dear Rus-tom-ji, i guess we should not mock the doongerwadi system.In this matter you are probably correct. HOW-ever the issue of discussion is that the problem starts when these “winged wonders”(vultures) start dropping human limbs all over the Metropolitan city of Mumbai. It tends to hurt the sensebilities of our fellow Indians,especially the vegetarians and the incident makes a mockery of the Parsees who as it is are seen as senile retards kind courtesy bollywood.

  • Contradhongee

    Never knew that all ancestral properties left in legacy were meant for a select few. Your round about way of saying that  nothing tangible has been done since 2008  uncovers and negates  your much repeated  remark of ‘strengthening’ the defunct system. Now blaming the same on others reminds me of a politician blaming all ills on the predecessor. Here suffice to state, that even before the current set of  BPP assumed Office, Khojeste Mistree was incharge of Doongerwadi affairs and the reduction in forest cover was taking place even five years back. I am unable to understand why you and your supporters i.e. if there are, cannot accept realities starring at us and allowing the prime property to ultimately fall in the hands of builder lobby once it is in disuse.
    As to your remark ‘  .i still wonder why the anti dokhma group haven’t founded their own crematoria. my counter question is why have you and persons ‘supporting’ you not established a separate Dakhmas. Learn to augment far-sightedness in the real sense of the term because name calling has not helped you so far and will not in future.Ultimately the prime land will fall in hands of builders and onus for the same will rest on shoulders of persons like you.

  • Contradhongee

    Never knew that all ancestral properties left in legacy were meant for a select few. Your round about way of saying that  nothing tangible has been done since 2008  uncovers and negates  your much repeated  remark of ‘strengthening’ the defunct system. Now blaming the same on others reminds me of a politician blaming all ills on the predecessor. Here suffice to state, that even before the current set of  BPP assumed Office, Khojeste Mistree was incharge of Doongerwadi affairs and the reduction in forest cover was taking place even five years back. I am unable to understand why you and your supporters i.e. if there are, cannot accept realities starring at us and allowing the prime property to ultimately fall in the hands of builder lobby once it is in disuse.
    As to your remark ‘  .i still wonder why the anti dokhma group haven’t founded their own crematoria. my counter question is why have you and persons ‘supporting’ you not established a separate Dakhmas. Learn to augment far-sightedness in the real sense of the term because name calling has not helped you so far and will not in future.Ultimately the prime land will fall in hands of builders and onus for the same will rest on shoulders of persons like you.

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_PHV6RFVDEWPSYUFVQK4J3X7KNM rustom j

    dhongee on your “Never knew that all ancestral properties left in legacy were meant for a select few. ‘..Well wake up and study the facts..the properties were left free of cost and even monies gathered for a purpose..for those who would practise zoroastrian practises, thus continuing zoroastrianism and in case of a challenge, strenghten it..it was not meant for all and sundry , just like monies gathered for sindhi, sikh, jain, tamil, foundations or like monies collected for Harvard, Mainz universities for specific purposes.

    As far as the dakhma fallin gin the hands of buildsers etc, as liong as the zoroastrian system is followed and zoroastrians do not counter acts that strenghten zoroastrian systems, it wil not happen, yet once zoroastrians start degrading their own, it is a sure start…

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_PHV6RFVDEWPSYUFVQK4J3X7KNM rustom j

    dhongee on your “Never knew that all ancestral properties left in legacy were meant for a select few. ‘..Well wake up and study the facts..the properties were left free of cost and even monies gathered for a purpose..for those who would practise zoroastrian practises, thus continuing zoroastrianism and in case of a challenge, strenghten it..it was not meant for all and sundry , just like monies gathered for sindhi, sikh, jain, tamil, foundations or like monies collected for Harvard, Mainz universities for specific purposes.

    As far as the dakhma fallin gin the hands of buildsers etc, as liong as the zoroastrian system is followed and zoroastrians do not counter acts that strenghten zoroastrian systems, it wil not happen, yet once zoroastrians start degrading their own, it is a sure start…

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_PHV6RFVDEWPSYUFVQK4J3X7KNM rustom j

    Hi Darayus…dont know if you would like me to break up the letters in your name or you do it out of some strange wisdom, id just let that part go…maybe it’ll give you a sense of victory or purpose.

    As far the wingeed wonder goes dropping human limbs….i wsh you had done some small studies…like the vulture cannot fly with anything in its beak!!!..thats a fact well known and even taught….another very interesting fact is that most youngsters see this lunked to the very altered photos that emited some time back…very poor photoshop work indeed…
    Yet i will acknowledge that the system needs to be strenghtened especially since a neglect has overshadowed it over the last 5 years..starting from hacking down trees in the comples in the 80’s……and thus aid in strenghtenign  zoroastrian systems…like for example the aden fire was flown in a plane for the first time and ever in the world…because of taking on a challenge positively instead of breaking up spellings..ridiculous strategy to think technically…

    Also please before you start another spell break up..do visit the so many succesfull vulture breeding programes..including the singapore zoo or better still at home..in India…

    1) When
    India’s vulture programme breeds success in 2007http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2007/jan/08/india.conservationandendangeredspeciesDhonge and ilk were battling against it2)The successful captive breeding and release programme of Eurasian Griffon vultures in Europe and the  captive breeding and release that saved the Californian Condor from extinction demonstrates that this approach will workhttp://www.vulturedeclines.org/page17.htmlNot only this, but fnding was done on an international scale..3) Population Status and Breeding Success of White- rumped Vulture Gyps bengalensis in Rampur, Syanja and Tanahu, Nepal4…black vultures are exploiting urbanizing landscapes, thanks to an increase in food sources such as roadkill and, from all indications, a warmer environment provided by growing acres of asphalt and concrete. In fact, the same things that draw new human residents to a burgeoning area are high on a vulture’s relocation wish list: Great roads. Warm climate. Lots of open space but still convenient to good shopping.  As natural land cover is replaced by parking lots, asphalt, and buildings, air and surface temperatures rise. The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency reports that many urban areas have air temperatures up to 10 degrees Fahrenheit warmer than the surrounding region. This so-called “urban heat island effect” is helpful to birds that require rising columns of heated air to locate food. “There is actually a new, manufactured thermal corridor that extends from Washington, D.C., to Philadelphia and on to New York,” says Bildstein. “Warmer urban areas create thermals, and there is no question that soaring birds are using them to great effect.”http://lancemannion.typepad.com/lance_mannion/2009/03/vultures-in-the-neighborhood.html5)“Bringing as many vultures into captivity as possible is the best way to save them from going extinct,”–Dr V. Prakash.6)Forest officials say that the Pinjore Vulture Breeding Centre in Haryana has succeeded in breeding vultures in captivity.There are so many more success stories around the world. Why? Because the world is aware of the dangers of loosing the vultures and have worked towards it and now are reaping the benefits…..one can point to many such truths…but of what use..the anti dakhma group doesnt want to see those, they want to shut other’s eyes too, they want to create chaos from the begining so that teh zoroastrian community cannot start such projects..and lastly sabotage as done and seen…

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_PHV6RFVDEWPSYUFVQK4J3X7KNM rustom j

    Hi Darayus…dont know if you would like me to break up the letters in your name or you do it out of some strange wisdom, id just let that part go…maybe it’ll give you a sense of victory or purpose.

    As far the wingeed wonder goes dropping human limbs….i wsh you had done some small studies…like the vulture cannot fly with anything in its beak!!!..thats a fact well known and even taught….another very interesting fact is that most youngsters see this lunked to the very altered photos that emited some time back…very poor photoshop work indeed…
    Yet i will acknowledge that the system needs to be strenghtened especially since a neglect has overshadowed it over the last 5 years..starting from hacking down trees in the comples in the 80’s……and thus aid in strenghtenign  zoroastrian systems…like for example the aden fire was flown in a plane for the first time and ever in the world…because of taking on a challenge positively instead of breaking up spellings..ridiculous strategy to think technically…

    Also please before you start another spell break up..do visit the so many succesfull vulture breeding programes..including the singapore zoo or better still at home..in India…

    1) When
    India’s vulture programme breeds success in 2007http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2007/jan/08/india.conservationandendangeredspeciesDhonge and ilk were battling against it2)The successful captive breeding and release programme of Eurasian Griffon vultures in Europe and the  captive breeding and release that saved the Californian Condor from extinction demonstrates that this approach will workhttp://www.vulturedeclines.org/page17.htmlNot only this, but fnding was done on an international scale..3) Population Status and Breeding Success of White- rumped Vulture Gyps bengalensis in Rampur, Syanja and Tanahu, Nepal4…black vultures are exploiting urbanizing landscapes, thanks to an increase in food sources such as roadkill and, from all indications, a warmer environment provided by growing acres of asphalt and concrete. In fact, the same things that draw new human residents to a burgeoning area are high on a vulture’s relocation wish list: Great roads. Warm climate. Lots of open space but still convenient to good shopping.  As natural land cover is replaced by parking lots, asphalt, and buildings, air and surface temperatures rise. The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency reports that many urban areas have air temperatures up to 10 degrees Fahrenheit warmer than the surrounding region. This so-called “urban heat island effect” is helpful to birds that require rising columns of heated air to locate food. “There is actually a new, manufactured thermal corridor that extends from Washington, D.C., to Philadelphia and on to New York,” says Bildstein. “Warmer urban areas create thermals, and there is no question that soaring birds are using them to great effect.”http://lancemannion.typepad.com/lance_mannion/2009/03/vultures-in-the-neighborhood.html5)“Bringing as many vultures into captivity as possible is the best way to save them from going extinct,”–Dr V. Prakash.6)Forest officials say that the Pinjore Vulture Breeding Centre in Haryana has succeeded in breeding vultures in captivity.There are so many more success stories around the world. Why? Because the world is aware of the dangers of loosing the vultures and have worked towards it and now are reaping the benefits…..one can point to many such truths…but of what use..the anti dakhma group doesnt want to see those, they want to shut other’s eyes too, they want to create chaos from the begining so that teh zoroastrian community cannot start such projects..and lastly sabotage as done and seen…

  • phiroze

    Hope you, shaimak and adar have read the posts of Ronnie, Burjor Piloomai, Rumi and got your answers. Give them a palm (Pun intended) and they will aske for the whole body.

  • phiroze

    Hope you, shaimak and adar have read the posts of Ronnie, Burjor Piloomai, Rumi and got your answers. Give them a palm (Pun intended) and they will aske for the whole body.

  • Adarbahman.

    Unless the drug viz pain killer Diclofenac is banned and greenery brought back (both of which are highly improbable) the system will remain defunct and Parsees will have to adopt an alternative. That is stark reality and from the number of  views of different persons here it is clear on what lines the community thinks. Time for Trustees of various Punchayats to take proactive steps to provide not only alternative system but simultaneously save our real estate from being taken over. A miniscule community has no scope of being heard as it is not a vote bank. It is a clarion call to arise before it is too late and already it is late as such issues are highlighted more in secular press. Can likes of  Rustom assure that they have political connections to prevent encroachments and take over of lands belonging to the community.Alternatively they should stop misleading Parsees.

  • Adarbahman.

    Unless the drug viz pain killer Diclofenac is banned and greenery brought back (both of which are highly improbable) the system will remain defunct and Parsees will have to adopt an alternative. That is stark reality and from the number of  views of different persons here it is clear on what lines the community thinks. Time for Trustees of various Punchayats to take proactive steps to provide not only alternative system but simultaneously save our real estate from being taken over. A miniscule community has no scope of being heard as it is not a vote bank. It is a clarion call to arise before it is too late and already it is late as such issues are highlighted more in secular press. Can likes of  Rustom assure that they have political connections to prevent encroachments and take over of lands belonging to the community.Alternatively they should stop misleading Parsees.

  • Rustom

    ‘Soot from an Ottawa crematorium has been falling and blowing on nearby homes, residents say, making it impossible at times to open their windows or sit outside.

    “We’ve all smelt it, we’ve all seen it, and it makes you … feel sick,” said Dawn Lynch, whose home is about 250 metres away from the crematorium. “It makes you feel like you’re breathing in the remnants of a … dead body.
    “http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/story/2009/09/30/ottawa-hope-crematorium-soot-findlay-creek.html

    To combat all these problems of environment pollution, technology came up with electric crematoriums. The electric cremation method started getting popular in India of-late as it was seen as an environment-friendly way of disposing the dead bodies. But even this doesn’t seem solving the problem. Electric cremation machines require enormous amount of electricity to burn the corpse into ashes also it emits green house gases. “Electric cremation is nearly seven times more intensive in terms of greenhouse gas emissions as compared to the traditional Hindu style of cremation,” a United Nations Development Programme (UNDP) report states.Electric cremation surely has helped in saving trees and reducing the cost of funerals but it hasn’t been able to solve the problem of environmental safety. In Mumbai, the residents of Jambhekar Maharaj Path complain of constant nausea and headache as their houses are covered under a layer of soot as the locality is next to an electric crematorium.As the problem of overconsumption of electricity came up, it gave way to crematoriums run on diesel. But this too doesn’t seem viable in the time where oil prices are spiralling. Also, to cremate one body nearly 30 litres of diesel is consumed which is a fossil fuel and a rapidly depleting non-renewable commodity.Read more at: http://www.merinews.com/article/funeral-pyres-choking-up-the-rivers-environment/15843014.shtml&cp

    Dozens speak out against proposed crematoriumBy Mike Ellis
    Posted July 8, 2010 at 8:30 p.m.ANDERSON — Dozens of people opposed to a proposed crematorium near downtown Anderson spoke against it during a public meeting Thursday.The residents’ concerns were almost exclusively about dental mercury that could end up in the atmosphere near The McDougald Funeral Home in downtown Anderson, which is asking the city to allow a crematorium.“Mercury is particularly damaging to fetuses and unborn children,” said Harry Morse, a physician who lives near the proposed site.
    http://www.independentmail.com/news/2010/jul/08/dozens-speak-out-against-proposed-crematorium/
    …………………………………………………………………………………………………………………….
    After NMMC installed a chimney at the site, residents of Turbhe preferred to keep their windows shut at home. However, since a month, the smoke emanating from the chimney situated amid residential buildings in the locality has made life difficult for the 20,000-odd residents. Residents say that there has been no respite from the nauseating fumes. Traders say that many of them had to be admitted to the hospital for nausea and breathing problems.Khajamiya Patel, a local resident and a political party member, contacted NMMC after observing “thick black smoke” emanating from the crematorium chimney on many occasions. Patel’s cousin Munawar, who lives near the crematorium, was concerned about his health and that of his 14-year-old son, along with other kids and students of a local school in the area. “My concerns are regarding the toxins that are released from the crematorium, which are hazardous to our health,” he said. His claim is strongly disputed by the staff at the crematorium, who said there were no health risks attached to the smoke. However, Patel said that even if the smoke wasn’t dangerous, it should not be released into the atmosphere. “Residential societies should be at an adequate distance from the crematorium,” said a medical expert. “If the charred human tissues are not treated at the right temperature, the suspended particles can have adverse effects on the residents’ respiration,” he added
    ……………………………

    For years, residents of Jambhekar Maharaj Path at Dadar sea-face have preferred to keep their windows shut when at home. Smoke emanating from an electric crematorium situated amid residential buildings in the locality has made life difficult for the 1000-odd residents. They are now up in arms against the Bhagoji Baloji Kir crematorium.
    DNA-Electric crematorium fumes leave Dadar residents fuming
    Published: Monday, Aug 30, 2010, 0:26 IST
    ………………………………………………………………………………
    April 28, 2011 (San Diego) – By a unanimous 4-0 vote, San Diego County’s Air Pollution Control District Board ordered an immediate shut down of  a Neptune Society crematorium  on Lake Jennings Road in El Cajon  to abate a public nuisance.  Smoke from facility“This was clearly a violation of public policy and a public health hazard,” Michael Drake, public affairs officer for the County’s land use and environmental group, told East County Magazine after the hearing.In spring and fall, we can’t have our windows open because of the stench from that place,” said George McNeil, who said after years of putting up with the smoke, he finally called  KUSI’s Turko Files.  “I have newspaper clippings of complaints going back 24 years. I couldn’t even go on my back patio and have a beer.  There are also psychological effects, knowing what it is—it’s burning human bodies.”

  • Rustom

    ‘Soot from an Ottawa crematorium has been falling and blowing on nearby homes, residents say, making it impossible at times to open their windows or sit outside.

    “We’ve all smelt it, we’ve all seen it, and it makes you … feel sick,” said Dawn Lynch, whose home is about 250 metres away from the crematorium. “It makes you feel like you’re breathing in the remnants of a … dead body.
    “http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/story/2009/09/30/ottawa-hope-crematorium-soot-findlay-creek.html

    To combat all these problems of environment pollution, technology came up with electric crematoriums. The electric cremation method started getting popular in India of-late as it was seen as an environment-friendly way of disposing the dead bodies. But even this doesn’t seem solving the problem. Electric cremation machines require enormous amount of electricity to burn the corpse into ashes also it emits green house gases. “Electric cremation is nearly seven times more intensive in terms of greenhouse gas emissions as compared to the traditional Hindu style of cremation,” a United Nations Development Programme (UNDP) report states.Electric cremation surely has helped in saving trees and reducing the cost of funerals but it hasn’t been able to solve the problem of environmental safety. In Mumbai, the residents of Jambhekar Maharaj Path complain of constant nausea and headache as their houses are covered under a layer of soot as the locality is next to an electric crematorium.As the problem of overconsumption of electricity came up, it gave way to crematoriums run on diesel. But this too doesn’t seem viable in the time where oil prices are spiralling. Also, to cremate one body nearly 30 litres of diesel is consumed which is a fossil fuel and a rapidly depleting non-renewable commodity.Read more at: http://www.merinews.com/article/funeral-pyres-choking-up-the-rivers-environment/15843014.shtml&cp

    Dozens speak out against proposed crematoriumBy Mike Ellis
    Posted July 8, 2010 at 8:30 p.m.ANDERSON — Dozens of people opposed to a proposed crematorium near downtown Anderson spoke against it during a public meeting Thursday.The residents’ concerns were almost exclusively about dental mercury that could end up in the atmosphere near The McDougald Funeral Home in downtown Anderson, which is asking the city to allow a crematorium.“Mercury is particularly damaging to fetuses and unborn children,” said Harry Morse, a physician who lives near the proposed site.
    http://www.independentmail.com/news/2010/jul/08/dozens-speak-out-against-proposed-crematorium/
    …………………………………………………………………………………………………………………….
    After NMMC installed a chimney at the site, residents of Turbhe preferred to keep their windows shut at home. However, since a month, the smoke emanating from the chimney situated amid residential buildings in the locality has made life difficult for the 20,000-odd residents. Residents say that there has been no respite from the nauseating fumes. Traders say that many of them had to be admitted to the hospital for nausea and breathing problems.Khajamiya Patel, a local resident and a political party member, contacted NMMC after observing “thick black smoke” emanating from the crematorium chimney on many occasions. Patel’s cousin Munawar, who lives near the crematorium, was concerned about his health and that of his 14-year-old son, along with other kids and students of a local school in the area. “My concerns are regarding the toxins that are released from the crematorium, which are hazardous to our health,” he said. His claim is strongly disputed by the staff at the crematorium, who said there were no health risks attached to the smoke. However, Patel said that even if the smoke wasn’t dangerous, it should not be released into the atmosphere. “Residential societies should be at an adequate distance from the crematorium,” said a medical expert. “If the charred human tissues are not treated at the right temperature, the suspended particles can have adverse effects on the residents’ respiration,” he added
    ……………………………

    For years, residents of Jambhekar Maharaj Path at Dadar sea-face have preferred to keep their windows shut when at home. Smoke emanating from an electric crematorium situated amid residential buildings in the locality has made life difficult for the 1000-odd residents. They are now up in arms against the Bhagoji Baloji Kir crematorium.
    DNA-Electric crematorium fumes leave Dadar residents fuming
    Published: Monday, Aug 30, 2010, 0:26 IST
    ………………………………………………………………………………
    April 28, 2011 (San Diego) – By a unanimous 4-0 vote, San Diego County’s Air Pollution Control District Board ordered an immediate shut down of  a Neptune Society crematorium  on Lake Jennings Road in El Cajon  to abate a public nuisance.  Smoke from facility“This was clearly a violation of public policy and a public health hazard,” Michael Drake, public affairs officer for the County’s land use and environmental group, told East County Magazine after the hearing.In spring and fall, we can’t have our windows open because of the stench from that place,” said George McNeil, who said after years of putting up with the smoke, he finally called  KUSI’s Turko Files.  “I have newspaper clippings of complaints going back 24 years. I couldn’t even go on my back patio and have a beer.  There are also psychological effects, knowing what it is—it’s burning human bodies.”

  • RATHESTAR

    Please reply to the issues raised by me in my above message and if you do not have anything substantial, the better course would be not to indulge in going off tangent.

  • RATHESTAR

    Please reply to the issues raised by me in my above message and if you do not have anything substantial, the better course would be not to indulge in going off tangent.

  • xyz

    I don’t understand why only Khojestee Mistree is solely responsible for bringing vultures in future. He has been promising the community since last five years with negative results. He will still promise the community for another 3 and half years i.e. for  his time left on the BPP board. Then he will not stand for elections or people will not elect him. All other trustees also gave many false promises that they have still not fulfilled. This is real PARSI POLITICS.

  • xyz

    I don’t understand why only Khojestee Mistree is solely responsible for bringing vultures in future. He has been promising the community since last five years with negative results. He will still promise the community for another 3 and half years i.e. for  his time left on the BPP board. Then he will not stand for elections or people will not elect him. All other trustees also gave many false promises that they have still not fulfilled. This is real PARSI POLITICS.

  • Rustom

    Hi Farsak…well at-least someone has acknowledged that there are faults with other systems too and that they are not perfect . 

    As far as your example of the Dr and the diabetes, well what you say only strengthens what ive been saying..just because there is a problem with a patient, one does not deem fit to totally eradicate the patient but to solve the problem…the anti dakhma group is saying since the system needs strengthening due to neglect and nil foresight we have to end the system altogether. Ironically your example says that we should work to improve other systems after adapting them but not strengthen zoroastrian system!! So 
    1) We do not improve our system but under the name of reviving zoroastrianism end its system.
    2) We adapt a system that Dr, researchers, scientists and other locals around the world do not want in their vicinity as the system has its perils including still birhts and impacting environment for decades thru entering the environment thru rainfall, polluting water bodies entering food chains of humans and animals and destroying then too.!!
    ( That system could possibly pollute even more than the dokhmenishini it its present state
    3) Then those who  want to shut eyes to the hows of strenghtening zoroastrian system want to now shut other’s  eyes to the ill effects on environment and health including still births..in the name of modernity and better system–
    4) Then those who do not want to strenghten dokhmenishini system nor wants others to work onn them nor ave the patience then give us anomolies like the dr and diabteis example where in the pro dakhma has been saying the same..if theres is a disease in apatient, treat and solve the disease…do not end the patient..!!

  • Rustom

    Hi Farsak…well at-least someone has acknowledged that there are faults with other systems too and that they are not perfect . 

    As far as your example of the Dr and the diabetes, well what you say only strengthens what ive been saying..just because there is a problem with a patient, one does not deem fit to totally eradicate the patient but to solve the problem…the anti dakhma group is saying since the system needs strengthening due to neglect and nil foresight we have to end the system altogether. Ironically your example says that we should work to improve other systems after adapting them but not strengthen zoroastrian system!! So 
    1) We do not improve our system but under the name of reviving zoroastrianism end its system.
    2) We adapt a system that Dr, researchers, scientists and other locals around the world do not want in their vicinity as the system has its perils including still birhts and impacting environment for decades thru entering the environment thru rainfall, polluting water bodies entering food chains of humans and animals and destroying then too.!!
    ( That system could possibly pollute even more than the dokhmenishini it its present state
    3) Then those who  want to shut eyes to the hows of strenghtening zoroastrian system want to now shut other’s  eyes to the ill effects on environment and health including still births..in the name of modernity and better system–
    4) Then those who do not want to strenghten dokhmenishini system nor wants others to work onn them nor ave the patience then give us anomolies like the dr and diabteis example where in the pro dakhma has been saying the same..if theres is a disease in apatient, treat and solve the disease…do not end the patient..!!

  • phiroze

    Those Parsis who want to adopt any alternative method are free to do so from those provided by the BMC / government. It is not the Trustees or the Punchayats job to do so. As long as the system is in use by the Parsis, there is no threat of take over of the complex. The boogey of secular press is an attempt by the likes of you to mislead the public in general and Parsis in particular being left with no other alternatives. It is the job of the whole community to protect an dpreserve these lands. 

  • phiroze

    Those Parsis who want to adopt any alternative method are free to do so from those provided by the BMC / government. It is not the Trustees or the Punchayats job to do so. As long as the system is in use by the Parsis, there is no threat of take over of the complex. The boogey of secular press is an attempt by the likes of you to mislead the public in general and Parsis in particular being left with no other alternatives. It is the job of the whole community to protect an dpreserve these lands. 

  • Cyrus

    I agree that it should be left to individuals or the family to decide on the method.. We need to let go off our old ways and start looking new less controvertial options.

  • Cyrus

    I agree that it should be left to individuals or the family to decide on the method.. We need to let go off our old ways and start looking new less controvertial options.

  • Er.Adarbahman

    Mr. Phiroze,
    Though I do not claim that current messages here reflect the actual mood of the entire community, the fact remains that apart from rustom and yourself, all others have opined for a change or a complimentary/supplementary method. Again I am repeating that this is itself not a large numbers to indicate the mood of the community. But nonetheless the fact that only two of you are adamant in declining to admit that the custom has collapsed shows that you are in definite minority. Just because this collapsed custo is used by many Parsees does not imply that majority is in its favour. There is no option. You cannot suggest a one horse race and declare it a winner.
    You say that it is the job of the whole community to protect and preserve the land and that is precisely what others who have broader horizon are attempting to do. Use the premises as funeral parlours and for offering sacraments for four days which will cut down BPP’s deficit as well.By causing hurdles in this process you are only waiting for some statutory order  and that will be too late. As an individual, do you have any plan to protect the land once the custom is banned by Health Authorities. The buildings – high rise around Malabar Hills are many besides Godrej Baug and such Buildings are occupied by a large section of Vegetarians. Just walk down the area and you will not find a single poultry shop or an Egg merchant. Do you think that such staunch vegetarians will tolerate such droppings of  parts of dead humans.? Just ponder before defending a lost cause. 

  • Er.Adarbahman

    Mr. Phiroze,
    Though I do not claim that current messages here reflect the actual mood of the entire community, the fact remains that apart from rustom and yourself, all others have opined for a change or a complimentary/supplementary method. Again I am repeating that this is itself not a large numbers to indicate the mood of the community. But nonetheless the fact that only two of you are adamant in declining to admit that the custom has collapsed shows that you are in definite minority. Just because this collapsed custo is used by many Parsees does not imply that majority is in its favour. There is no option. You cannot suggest a one horse race and declare it a winner.
    You say that it is the job of the whole community to protect and preserve the land and that is precisely what others who have broader horizon are attempting to do. Use the premises as funeral parlours and for offering sacraments for four days which will cut down BPP’s deficit as well.By causing hurdles in this process you are only waiting for some statutory order  and that will be too late. As an individual, do you have any plan to protect the land once the custom is banned by Health Authorities. The buildings – high rise around Malabar Hills are many besides Godrej Baug and such Buildings are occupied by a large section of Vegetarians. Just walk down the area and you will not find a single poultry shop or an Egg merchant. Do you think that such staunch vegetarians will tolerate such droppings of  parts of dead humans.? Just ponder before defending a lost cause. 

  • Er.Adarbahman

    Mr. Phiroze,
    Though I do not claim that current messages here reflect the actual mood of the entire community, the fact remains that apart from rustom and yourself, all others have opined for a change or a complimentary/supplementary method. Again I am repeating that this is itself not a large numbers to indicate the mood of the community. But nonetheless the fact that only two of you are adamant in declining to admit that the custom has collapsed shows that you are in definite minority. Just because this collapsed custo is used by many Parsees does not imply that majority is in its favour. There is no option. You cannot suggest a one horse race and declare it a winner.
    You say that it is the job of the whole community to protect and preserve the land and that is precisely what others who have broader horizon are attempting to do. Use the premises as funeral parlours and for offering sacraments for four days which will cut down BPP’s deficit as well.By causing hurdles in this process you are only waiting for some statutory order  and that will be too late. As an individual, do you have any plan to protect the land once the custom is banned by Health Authorities. The buildings – high rise around Malabar Hills are many besides Godrej Baug and such Buildings are occupied by a large section of Vegetarians. Just walk down the area and you will not find a single poultry shop or an Egg merchant. Do you think that such staunch vegetarians will tolerate such droppings of  parts of dead humans.? Just ponder before defending a lost cause. 

  • Contradhongi

    @Rustomji; The psychiatrists will need treatment after attempting to treat  such an acute case of prejudice and bigot-ism.

  • Contradhongi

    @Rustomji; The psychiatrists will need treatment after attempting to treat  such an acute case of prejudice and bigot-ism.

  • I LOVE DOKHMENASHINI

    Sharam karo tamlok deformisto…. Parsio maatej Dokhmenashinij chhe, biju kai nai…..

  • I LOVE DOKHMENASHINI

    Sharam karo tamlok deformisto…. Parsio maatej Dokhmenashinij chhe, biju kai nai…..

  • Darius Khambatta

    Dear ILD, since  you are such a big fan of the Doonger  ,we’ll wait for you to kick the bucket .After that u can have a rollicking time with the big bird. Silly fellow, celebrate & love LIFE ..not death.

  • Darius Khambatta

    Dear ILD, since  you are such a big fan of the Doonger  ,we’ll wait for you to kick the bucket .After that u can have a rollicking time with the big bird. Silly fellow, celebrate & love LIFE ..not death.

  • Darius Khambatta

    Dear rustom j (without spellbreak). Thank you for taking out your valuable time to explain avian breeding techniques to the laymen.It is certainly a eye opener as to the lengths human beings go to breed other creatures while putting in a maximum effort to destroy his own species.Its a paradox. In fact Parsees and vultures have much in common…both are going EXTINCT. So once the vulture breeding techniques are successful and formalised , it is my suggestion that the same be applied to Parsees. I’d be grateful if you could monitor the progress and provide us a url link (at which u seem good at) under the header “vulture & parsee breeding techniques”For all u know we might produce a “uber parsee”…a human who can fly !!
    p.s. dont get too carried away by internet articles…the article is only as good as the author who wrote it with dubious credentials.Here today,gone tommorow.

  • Darius Khambatta

    Dear rustom j (without spellbreak). Thank you for taking out your valuable time to explain avian breeding techniques to the laymen.It is certainly a eye opener as to the lengths human beings go to breed other creatures while putting in a maximum effort to destroy his own species.Its a paradox. In fact Parsees and vultures have much in common…both are going EXTINCT. So once the vulture breeding techniques are successful and formalised , it is my suggestion that the same be applied to Parsees. I’d be grateful if you could monitor the progress and provide us a url link (at which u seem good at) under the header “vulture & parsee breeding techniques”For all u know we might produce a “uber parsee”…a human who can fly !!
    p.s. dont get too carried away by internet articles…the article is only as good as the author who wrote it with dubious credentials.Here today,gone tommorow.

  • Behroze

    Learn the distinction between community and Religion.
    Learn the difference between Race and Religion.
    Understand the difference between CUSTOM AND RELIGION
    Understand the difference between true Orthodoxy and devotion to Religion and blind following of customs.
    Understand the difference between a devout Zoroasatrian  who believes in what he sees and observes and follows dictates of his conscience – the good mind against rank reformists who are out to convert to increase the Parsee population..
    A thousand pities against a person so bigoted and fundamentalist who does not want to use his good mind, his own vision . It is such a person who is a DHONGIDOX and not who acts on what he observes.
    In any case, no prizes for guessing who ILD is.

  • Behroze

    Learn the distinction between community and Religion.
    Learn the difference between Race and Religion.
    Understand the difference between CUSTOM AND RELIGION
    Understand the difference between true Orthodoxy and devotion to Religion and blind following of customs.
    Understand the difference between a devout Zoroasatrian  who believes in what he sees and observes and follows dictates of his conscience – the good mind against rank reformists who are out to convert to increase the Parsee population..
    A thousand pities against a person so bigoted and fundamentalist who does not want to use his good mind, his own vision . It is such a person who is a DHONGIDOX and not who acts on what he observes.
    In any case, no prizes for guessing who ILD is.

  • Rashna.

    Behroze, This happens to those who spend forty eight hours in “prayers’  prior to Navroze with their P.C. working over time

  • Rashna.

    Behroze, This happens to those who spend forty eight hours in “prayers’  prior to Navroze with their P.C. working over time

  • Rashna.

    Rustom.
    Let me make it a bit simple for you. Let us assume that you – choost Parsee  are having a T.V. Set which is not working. Likewise T.V. Sets of one Christian follower and another Hindoo are having T.V.’s having some defects. Will you still retain your T.V. Set though not working because the T.V.  sets  of your Christian and Hindoo friends are giving them problems?

  • Rashna.

    Rustom.
    Let me make it a bit simple for you. Let us assume that you – choost Parsee  are having a T.V. Set which is not working. Likewise T.V. Sets of one Christian follower and another Hindoo are having T.V.’s having some defects. Will you still retain your T.V. Set though not working because the T.V.  sets  of your Christian and Hindoo friends are giving them problems?

  • Burzin

    Hi Rashna,

    It’s not that simple. Are you suggesting that just because our TV set is not working, we bring home the faulty TV set belonging to our Christian / Hindu neighbours into our home?

    We need to strengthen our system of dokhmenashini (khorshed nagirashni) which I still insist is the best.

    For all those who wish to adopt other methods – you may do so and use other facilities provided by the municipal council. The Doongerwadi properties are meant to be used only for ‘Dokhmenashini’. Period.

  • Burzin

    Hi Rashna,

    It’s not that simple. Are you suggesting that just because our TV set is not working, we bring home the faulty TV set belonging to our Christian / Hindu neighbours into our home?

    We need to strengthen our system of dokhmenashini (khorshed nagirashni) which I still insist is the best.

    For all those who wish to adopt other methods – you may do so and use other facilities provided by the municipal council. The Doongerwadi properties are meant to be used only for ‘Dokhmenashini’. Period.

  • A True Athornan

    @  I LOVE DOKHMENASHINI.
     I happen to be a staunch Athornanzada. I have one simple question for you. We Parsees do not permit a non Parsee friend, colleague or neigbour to see the face of the deceased and perform Sezdo. But persons like you have no problem  when the body of the  Parsee Ruvan after Geh Sarna is carried away by pall bearers whose ancestry or origin is Adivasis but have adorned Sudreh Kusti for sake of employment very much like a Postman or a Peon’s Uniform. Get affidavits from all pall bearers about their parents and grandparents , maternal and paternal, their place of birth and birth certificates and thereafter who will will have to be ashamed (SHARAM KARVANI) will be your privilege.

  • A True Athornan

    @  I LOVE DOKHMENASHINI.
     I happen to be a staunch Athornanzada. I have one simple question for you. We Parsees do not permit a non Parsee friend, colleague or neigbour to see the face of the deceased and perform Sezdo. But persons like you have no problem  when the body of the  Parsee Ruvan after Geh Sarna is carried away by pall bearers whose ancestry or origin is Adivasis but have adorned Sudreh Kusti for sake of employment very much like a Postman or a Peon’s Uniform. Get affidavits from all pall bearers about their parents and grandparents , maternal and paternal, their place of birth and birth certificates and thereafter who will will have to be ashamed (SHARAM KARVANI) will be your privilege.

  • phiroze

    I have replied to the issue you raised about who has asked for setting up cremation facilities at the doongerwadi? Coming to your next issue are you trying to say that Parsis cut up the body before putting it in the TOS? Once again I say we have failed the system and not the other way around. As long Parsis opt for this system as per our custom the lands are secure.

  • phiroze

    I have replied to the issue you raised about who has asked for setting up cremation facilities at the doongerwadi? Coming to your next issue are you trying to say that Parsis cut up the body before putting it in the TOS? Once again I say we have failed the system and not the other way around. As long Parsis opt for this system as per our custom the lands are secure.

  • Rathestar

    Darius, Such persons like ILD ought to reserve their berth during his lfe time in the pits as there would be a ‘long  waiting list’ before him as demand may exceed supply. On a seious note, one observes that if a Christian, Hindu or a Muslim passes away, the corpse is carried to its ultimate resting place by  next of kin,relatives.and friends.
    Now comes a question for all dhongees.From where did the concept of khandhias and Nassesalars germinate? IS IT ALSO A PART OF RELIGION or IS IT A CUSTOM. The purpose I have raised this issue is that there is a feeling amongst many Parsees incliding strict orthodox that this system of  paid pall bearers is just a ruse to cover up the real  condition in the pits.

  • Rathestar

    Darius, Such persons like ILD ought to reserve their berth during his lfe time in the pits as there would be a ‘long  waiting list’ before him as demand may exceed supply. On a seious note, one observes that if a Christian, Hindu or a Muslim passes away, the corpse is carried to its ultimate resting place by  next of kin,relatives.and friends.
    Now comes a question for all dhongees.From where did the concept of khandhias and Nassesalars germinate? IS IT ALSO A PART OF RELIGION or IS IT A CUSTOM. The purpose I have raised this issue is that there is a feeling amongst many Parsees incliding strict orthodox that this system of  paid pall bearers is just a ruse to cover up the real  condition in the pits.

  • Rashna

    @Burrin:disqus :I f your or my T.V. Set is not working then we would straight away replace it and not say that because my neighbours T.V. too is giving hiccups, I will retain my non working dubba.  Your last para is the usual stuff argued by a couple of short-sighted individuals who want to risk losing this prime land to land sharks. Just imagine, instead of landing in Jokhi Fire Temple Compound, had the same palm landed in house of  a non Parsee or worse still bungalow of a politician.

  • Rashna

    @Burrin:disqus :I f your or my T.V. Set is not working then we would straight away replace it and not say that because my neighbours T.V. too is giving hiccups, I will retain my non working dubba.  Your last para is the usual stuff argued by a couple of short-sighted individuals who want to risk losing this prime land to land sharks. Just imagine, instead of landing in Jokhi Fire Temple Compound, had the same palm landed in house of  a non Parsee or worse still bungalow of a politician.

  • F Kanga

    It is those  muppets  who are misleading that the ‘system is working fine’  who ought to be ashamed. Since last four years I have been reading persons like R Jamasji talking of strenghthening the system which actually is getting worse every day. How long this ‘community welfare workers’ mislead the Parsees.
     Not everybody can be fooled at all times.
     There is a limit to assuming that all Parsees will continue to repose faith in false assurances and emotional appeals these persons shamelessly utter without any concrete steps to rectify the ills of the erstwhile system.

  • F Kanga

    It is those  muppets  who are misleading that the ‘system is working fine’  who ought to be ashamed. Since last four years I have been reading persons like R Jamasji talking of strenghthening the system which actually is getting worse every day. How long this ‘community welfare workers’ mislead the Parsees.
     Not everybody can be fooled at all times.
     There is a limit to assuming that all Parsees will continue to repose faith in false assurances and emotional appeals these persons shamelessly utter without any concrete steps to rectify the ills of the erstwhile system.

  • xyz

    I fully endorse Dokhmenashini and I request people concerned in BPP to try their level best to find vultures on top priority. I have also seen photographs of Corpses by Dhun Baria in connivance with one ex trustee of BPP. Really shameful pics. After one eyar. Khandias burn these dead bodies. We must find a solution immediately on top priority.

  • xyz

    I fully endorse Dokhmenashini and I request people concerned in BPP to try their level best to find vultures on top priority. I have also seen photographs of Corpses by Dhun Baria in connivance with one ex trustee of BPP. Really shameful pics. After one eyar. Khandias burn these dead bodies. We must find a solution immediately on top priority.

  • Logical Bawaji

    Why do the reformists want to set up a crematorium or burial ground on the doongerwadi complex when they themselves state that the surrounding area is stinking, rotting, body parts are flying around the premises, etc. On the contrary they should STAY AWAY from that area and set up their own infrastructure far away from this place. Dear reformists, please stay away from doongerwadi and keep your renegade priests out from here otherwise their precious health will deteriorate on account of the stink and germs, they might fall sick and replacements will be hard to find. Conduct your prayers, disposal procedure elsewhere wherever the environment is clean and pollution free.

  • Logical Bawaji

    Why do the reformists want to set up a crematorium or burial ground on the doongerwadi complex when they themselves state that the surrounding area is stinking, rotting, body parts are flying around the premises, etc. On the contrary they should STAY AWAY from that area and set up their own infrastructure far away from this place. Dear reformists, please stay away from doongerwadi and keep your renegade priests out from here otherwise their precious health will deteriorate on account of the stink and germs, they might fall sick and replacements will be hard to find. Conduct your prayers, disposal procedure elsewhere wherever the environment is clean and pollution free.

  • Rustom

    Mr Kanga….I am talking of strenghtening the dakhma system for more than a year., probably 5. And it would have made a difference positively if the likes of you instead of bel;ttling everything constructive even to start a thought process, you would have half as mucb pressueised to improve and strenghten the system or at least look scientifuically at the cons of other syustems that your ilkj so much promotes as the answer to all dificuklties.
    At least with your ilk trying to divert the attention away from my original posts of the problems faced by crematoriums and example given of it world wide, it gets more clear that your agenda is anti dakhmenishini…even if it means gettign  something as or more worse scientifically. Actaully the youngsters are seing thru your ilks propoganda unbder pseudo organisations and names including one for reviving zoroastruianbism..by ending its system.,.In any case you can try and wash away the problems of crematoruiums and burials that plage the world but iot wont change scientific principles..nor the problems with other modes, nor the fact that as others try and focus on their own problem,s and solving theirs…yours give up and nullify even thinkign provess of it though the world is battl;ing and gaining on the problem at hand….about your time frame and being tired…you would be donnign  a beard n ure female fmaily members a birkha…cause it toik more than 300 yeaers for our ancestiors to continue to preserve and pass on zoroastrian systems…from Alexander’s holocaust to the byzantine wartrs to the last holiocaust my arabs…it sopanned a millenia…and people like you want to end the efforst in a span of a year!!! thought provoking

  • Rustom

    Mr Kanga….I am talking of strenghtening the dakhma system for more than a year., probably 5. And it would have made a difference positively if the likes of you instead of bel;ttling everything constructive even to start a thought process, you would have half as mucb pressueised to improve and strenghten the system or at least look scientifuically at the cons of other syustems that your ilkj so much promotes as the answer to all dificuklties.
    At least with your ilk trying to divert the attention away from my original posts of the problems faced by crematoriums and example given of it world wide, it gets more clear that your agenda is anti dakhmenishini…even if it means gettign  something as or more worse scientifically. Actaully the youngsters are seing thru your ilks propoganda unbder pseudo organisations and names including one for reviving zoroastruianbism..by ending its system.,.In any case you can try and wash away the problems of crematoruiums and burials that plage the world but iot wont change scientific principles..nor the problems with other modes, nor the fact that as others try and focus on their own problem,s and solving theirs…yours give up and nullify even thinkign provess of it though the world is battl;ing and gaining on the problem at hand….about your time frame and being tired…you would be donnign  a beard n ure female fmaily members a birkha…cause it toik more than 300 yeaers for our ancestiors to continue to preserve and pass on zoroastrian systems…from Alexander’s holocaust to the byzantine wartrs to the last holiocaust my arabs…it sopanned a millenia…and people like you want to end the efforst in a span of a year!!! thought provoking

  • Rustom

    I think the pro dokha group must collect money and give it to the groiup that thinkws ending zoro systems revibe it….atleast that way they wuill get ecverythign for free, wont have to lift a finger and we can carry on the zoroasstrin systems and even strenghten it…..

  • Rustom

    I think the pro dokha group must collect money and give it to the groiup that thinkws ending zoro systems revibe it….atleast that way they wuill get ecverythign for free, wont have to lift a finger and we can carry on the zoroasstrin systems and even strenghten it…..

  • F Kanga

    Mr. Rustom. Your English is incomprehensible   and I cannot fathom what you are trying to convey. Perhaps. may be,  I am not conversant with SMS type of language.Any way your helplessness is noted. Can you specify what steps you would take during next twelve months to
     ‘strenghtening the dakhma system’ to use your terminology.
    To Logical Bawaji: Noted your desire to see that the precious lands should be allowed to be disused to so that BPP Trustees, (may be future ones) can sell the land and ultimately persons who think and utter like you will  fall back on “reformist’ systems.If some of you want to learn the hard way, so be it.
    For those who do not want to read the writings on the wall, nothing is possible. It is akin to an illiterate youngster refusing to learn the three R’s. 
    FYI, all persons who rely on their intelligence and what they observe are not necessarily reformists.

  • F Kanga

    Mr. Rustom. Your English is incomprehensible   and I cannot fathom what you are trying to convey. Perhaps. may be,  I am not conversant with SMS type of language.Any way your helplessness is noted. Can you specify what steps you would take during next twelve months to
     ‘strenghtening the dakhma system’ to use your terminology.
    To Logical Bawaji: Noted your desire to see that the precious lands should be allowed to be disused to so that BPP Trustees, (may be future ones) can sell the land and ultimately persons who think and utter like you will  fall back on “reformist’ systems.If some of you want to learn the hard way, so be it.
    For those who do not want to read the writings on the wall, nothing is possible. It is akin to an illiterate youngster refusing to learn the three R’s. 
    FYI, all persons who rely on their intelligence and what they observe are not necessarily reformists.

  • Darius Khambatta

    Dear Rustom, how high was your blood pressure when you wrote this comment ? Its full of spelling & grammatical  mistakes, to the point of being nonsencial/unreadable. Calm down, or you might be the next one on the way to the doongerwadi (i mean the dead one,ok).

  • Darius Khambatta

    Dear Rustom, how high was your blood pressure when you wrote this comment ? Its full of spelling & grammatical  mistakes, to the point of being nonsencial/unreadable. Calm down, or you might be the next one on the way to the doongerwadi (i mean the dead one,ok).

  • Darius Khambatta

    Dear Rusi, either your blood pressure really shoots when you write comments or you definitely need new reading glasses.

  • Darius Khambatta

    Dear Rusi, either your blood pressure really shoots when you write comments or you definitely need new reading glasses.

  • Rustom

    haha  nice one darius….well observed..n ill keep the first one in check

  • phiroze

    Rathestar, it is only in Mumbai where reformist sethias dwell that you have this paid pall bearers system of khandias. In villages it is strictly voluntary and many consider it an honour to perform these rites.  

  • I LOVE BOONAK PASBANI

    arrey tamlokna naako to kapai gaya…ave mona kaara karvach su??? sudhri jaav deformisto!!!!!

  • I LOVE BOONAK PASBANI

    arrey tamlokna naako to kapai gaya…ave mona kaara karvach su??? sudhri jaav deformisto!!!!!

  • RATHESTAR.

    What has Boonak Pasbani got to do with disposal of dead when the dead after Geh Sarna are carried into the pits by Adivasi men wearing the Sudreh Kustee. You mean Adivasi boys have boonak pasbani.?. Yes we want our faces to be BLACKENED . .In the process we will establish that voices like you are a minority but were vociferous and loud  mouthed  to create a sense of false impression that they constituted majority. People were scared of coming out in the open because filthy language the likes of you spewed but no longer.
    Here it is a case of what the average opinion expects the average opinion to be and it is overwhelmingly in favour of improved method of disposal of dead in a dignified manner. You Loved a failed system. Keep Loving it. But saying that Adivasi pall bearers are Boonak Pasbani is insulting the entire community. Yes I too Love Boonak Pasbani but not selectively like “Vada” Priests who sanction Navjotes of non Parsee because they get in return a couple of flats.
    Next time, before you utter the words Boonak Pasbani, think twice.

  • RATHESTAR.

    What has Boonak Pasbani got to do with disposal of dead when the dead after Geh Sarna are carried into the pits by Adivasi men wearing the Sudreh Kustee. You mean Adivasi boys have boonak pasbani.?. Yes we want our faces to be BLACKENED . .In the process we will establish that voices like you are a minority but were vociferous and loud  mouthed  to create a sense of false impression that they constituted majority. People were scared of coming out in the open because filthy language the likes of you spewed but no longer.
    Here it is a case of what the average opinion expects the average opinion to be and it is overwhelmingly in favour of improved method of disposal of dead in a dignified manner. You Loved a failed system. Keep Loving it. But saying that Adivasi pall bearers are Boonak Pasbani is insulting the entire community. Yes I too Love Boonak Pasbani but not selectively like “Vada” Priests who sanction Navjotes of non Parsee because they get in return a couple of flats.
    Next time, before you utter the words Boonak Pasbani, think twice.

  • Behroze Sidhwa.

    ILBP -Your remark ‘ave mona karavanch su’ smacks of slogan shouting. Those who are capable of doing some thing tangible and positive do not hide behind the mask of anonymity though one can understand your remarks in Gujarati perhaps due to lack of proficiency in English. I am sorry, I cannot express in Gujarati that fluently. But nobody is going to get cowed down by threats. Those days are long past.  Uttering slogans is a job assigned by cheap politicians to unemployed persons to show their ‘support base’ for which slogan shouters are paid. Our community is too matured and educated to get ‘impressed’ by slogans. The last time the community got carried away was during 2008 BPP Elections – Religion in Danger and the community is paying the price of falling in this trap, very dearly.If you have moral courage, disclose your name rather than remaining in “BURKA’ which is he dress for suppressed ans semi literate  ladies under the yoke of fundamentalists.

  • Behroze Sidhwa.

    ILBP -Your remark ‘ave mona karavanch su’ smacks of slogan shouting. Those who are capable of doing some thing tangible and positive do not hide behind the mask of anonymity though one can understand your remarks in Gujarati perhaps due to lack of proficiency in English. I am sorry, I cannot express in Gujarati that fluently. But nobody is going to get cowed down by threats. Those days are long past.  Uttering slogans is a job assigned by cheap politicians to unemployed persons to show their ‘support base’ for which slogan shouters are paid. Our community is too matured and educated to get ‘impressed’ by slogans. The last time the community got carried away was during 2008 BPP Elections – Religion in Danger and the community is paying the price of falling in this trap, very dearly.If you have moral courage, disclose your name rather than remaining in “BURKA’ which is he dress for suppressed ans semi literate  ladies under the yoke of fundamentalists.

  • Contradhongi

    IS BOONAK PASBANI NOT THE SAME THING WHICH A BILLIONAIRE CAN ACQUIRE IN BARTER FOR A FLAT IN A PREMIUM PARSI COLONY, A MOTNHLY DOLE,TWO AIR TICKETS PER YEAR TO THE WESTERN COUNTRIES AND FREE SURGERY OF THE KNEE BY A TOP ORTHOPAEDIC SURGEON SPECIALLY FLOWN.?

  • Contradhongi

    IS BOONAK PASBANI NOT THE SAME THING WHICH A BILLIONAIRE CAN ACQUIRE IN BARTER FOR A FLAT IN A PREMIUM PARSI COLONY, A MOTNHLY DOLE,TWO AIR TICKETS PER YEAR TO THE WESTERN COUNTRIES AND FREE SURGERY OF THE KNEE BY A TOP ORTHOPAEDIC SURGEON SPECIALLY FLOWN.?

  • Contradhongi

    IS BOONAK PASBANI NOT THE SAME THING WHICH A BILLIONAIRE CAN ACQUIRE IN BARTER FOR A FLAT IN A PREMIUM PARSI COLONY, A MOTNHLY DOLE,TWO AIR TICKETS PER YEAR TO THE WESTERN COUNTRIES AND FREE SURGERY OF THE KNEE BY A TOP ORTHOPAEDIC SURGEON SPECIALLY FLOWN.?

  • Rustom

    Vulture numbers go up in Girnar hills   Press Trust of India / Vadodara May 29, 2012, 14:45
    The number of the endangered vultures and their nests has considerably increased in the last two years in Girnar hills of Junagadh, a city-based NGO said today.
    There are 131 vultures and 85 nests of the scavengers in the hills currently, as compared to 69 long-billed vultures and 24 nests two years ago, Dinesh Goswami of Prakruti, an NGO, told PTI today.

    “Volunteers of our NGO were engaged in counting of vultures and their nests in Girnar at Junagadh on May 26 and 27. The number shows that there is a considerable increase in the population of vultures,” he said.
    131 vultures were spotted on Girnar hills and in Devaliya park. There were various types of vultures in the Gir forests, including Dakugidh, Rajgidh, Kherogidh and Girnarigidh,” he added.
    The vultures and their nests are present right at the place from where the ropeway project (for the facility of devotees) is proposed on Girnar hills, he said.
    Vultures come under schedule (1) of the Wildlife Protection Act.
    http://www.business-standard.com/generalnews/news/vulture-numbers-goin-girnar-hills/14623/

  • Rustom

    Vulture numbers go up in Girnar hills   Press Trust of India / Vadodara May 29, 2012, 14:45
    The number of the endangered vultures and their nests has considerably increased in the last two years in Girnar hills of Junagadh, a city-based NGO said today.
    There are 131 vultures and 85 nests of the scavengers in the hills currently, as compared to 69 long-billed vultures and 24 nests two years ago, Dinesh Goswami of Prakruti, an NGO, told PTI today.

    “Volunteers of our NGO were engaged in counting of vultures and their nests in Girnar at Junagadh on May 26 and 27. The number shows that there is a considerable increase in the population of vultures,” he said.
    131 vultures were spotted on Girnar hills and in Devaliya park. There were various types of vultures in the Gir forests, including Dakugidh, Rajgidh, Kherogidh and Girnarigidh,” he added.
    The vultures and their nests are present right at the place from where the ropeway project (for the facility of devotees) is proposed on Girnar hills, he said.
    Vultures come under schedule (1) of the Wildlife Protection Act.
    http://www.business-standard.com/generalnews/news/vulture-numbers-goin-girnar-hills/14623/

  • Rustom

    In a first, captive-bred vultures to be released in AhmedabadVijaysinh Parmar, TNN | May 29, 2012, 03.07AM ISTAHMEDABAD/MAHUVA: Vulture conservation in Gujarat has got a major boost with the Bombay Natural History Society (BNHS) selecting Mahuva and Ahmedabad among the six provisional vultures’ safe zones (VSZ) in India. Within three years, vultures successfully bred in captivity under the BNHS’s Save Asia’s Vultures from Extinction (SAVE) programme will be released in their natural environments in Mahuva.

    The move comes as a recognition of sorts for years of hard work put in by NGOs. They launched awareness campaigns in this coastal town against the use of diclofenac, the Non-Steroidal Anti-Inflammatory (NSAID) which is the main cause of sharp decline in vulture population.

    “The aim of developing VSZs is to establish targeted awareness activities surrounding 150 km radius of vultures’ colonies so that no diclofenac or the veterinary toxic drugs are found in cattle carcasses, the main food of vultures. We noticed that considerable work has been done at Mahuva in Bhavnagar and Ahmedabad in this direction,” Dr Vibhu Prakash, deputy director, BNHS told TOI.

    The society will concentrate on Saurashtra and central Gujarat first as these regions have good vulture population. “Mahuva is being considered as the first such site in the country to release captive-bred vultures in the wild within the next three years,” said Prakash, who heads the vulture breeding programme in India.

    Prakash said the vultures are in peril, particularly the Gyps species like Oriental White-backed Vulture, Longbilled Vulture and Slender-billed Vulture. Gujarat is particularly important for vultures due to presence of animal shelters running in the state.

    “These sites take in injured and abandoned cattle which are placed out for vultures to feed upon once they die. They have been quick to stop the use of diclofenac and instead use meloxicam,” said Janki Teli, Vulture Advocacy Officer, BNHS.

    Of the four other provisional VSZs, two are in Uttar Pradesh, while Assam and Jharkhandhave got one each. 

  • Rustom

    In a first, captive-bred vultures to be released in AhmedabadVijaysinh Parmar, TNN | May 29, 2012, 03.07AM ISTAHMEDABAD/MAHUVA: Vulture conservation in Gujarat has got a major boost with the Bombay Natural History Society (BNHS) selecting Mahuva and Ahmedabad among the six provisional vultures’ safe zones (VSZ) in India. Within three years, vultures successfully bred in captivity under the BNHS’s Save Asia’s Vultures from Extinction (SAVE) programme will be released in their natural environments in Mahuva.

    The move comes as a recognition of sorts for years of hard work put in by NGOs. They launched awareness campaigns in this coastal town against the use of diclofenac, the Non-Steroidal Anti-Inflammatory (NSAID) which is the main cause of sharp decline in vulture population.

    “The aim of developing VSZs is to establish targeted awareness activities surrounding 150 km radius of vultures’ colonies so that no diclofenac or the veterinary toxic drugs are found in cattle carcasses, the main food of vultures. We noticed that considerable work has been done at Mahuva in Bhavnagar and Ahmedabad in this direction,” Dr Vibhu Prakash, deputy director, BNHS told TOI.

    The society will concentrate on Saurashtra and central Gujarat first as these regions have good vulture population. “Mahuva is being considered as the first such site in the country to release captive-bred vultures in the wild within the next three years,” said Prakash, who heads the vulture breeding programme in India.

    Prakash said the vultures are in peril, particularly the Gyps species like Oriental White-backed Vulture, Longbilled Vulture and Slender-billed Vulture. Gujarat is particularly important for vultures due to presence of animal shelters running in the state.

    “These sites take in injured and abandoned cattle which are placed out for vultures to feed upon once they die. They have been quick to stop the use of diclofenac and instead use meloxicam,” said Janki Teli, Vulture Advocacy Officer, BNHS.

    Of the four other provisional VSZs, two are in Uttar Pradesh, while Assam and Jharkhandhave got one each. 

  • F. Kanga

    @Rustom:
     If I recollect rightly, you have been harping on this topic since 2008 and I would be grateful if you could provide to  ‘non thinkers’ like me you prescription to ‘strengthen’ the dead system.BTW, we are in Mumbai and NOT Mahuva. The climatic conditions and environments of Mahuva differ vastly from Kemp’s Corner , Mumbai. I will not be astonished if you dispute this fact as well but frankly, most readers are tired of reading your repetitious  recorded version without  you being able to show any tangible improvement in working of this dead ‘system’ in the four preceding years. On my part, I will not be surprised if somebody alleges ulterior motive on your part in promoting this propaganda inasmuch as you  have not been able to show the steps so far taken to ‘strengthen’ the failed system. One can strengthen something that has become weak but you cannot expect a dead body to enter a boxing ring and  knock out the opponent. Lastly, I wonder how this portal allows such irrelevant references to Alexander and Arabs in a subject that has nothing to do with  these persons. Rustom, in conclusion, I can only pity a person who falls back on a single word  ‘strengthen’ without anything concrete to be shown.

  • F. Kanga

    @Rustom:
     If I recollect rightly, you have been harping on this topic since 2008 and I would be grateful if you could provide to  ‘non thinkers’ like me you prescription to ‘strengthen’ the dead system.BTW, we are in Mumbai and NOT Mahuva. The climatic conditions and environments of Mahuva differ vastly from Kemp’s Corner , Mumbai. I will not be astonished if you dispute this fact as well but frankly, most readers are tired of reading your repetitious  recorded version without  you being able to show any tangible improvement in working of this dead ‘system’ in the four preceding years. On my part, I will not be surprised if somebody alleges ulterior motive on your part in promoting this propaganda inasmuch as you  have not been able to show the steps so far taken to ‘strengthen’ the failed system. One can strengthen something that has become weak but you cannot expect a dead body to enter a boxing ring and  knock out the opponent. Lastly, I wonder how this portal allows such irrelevant references to Alexander and Arabs in a subject that has nothing to do with  these persons. Rustom, in conclusion, I can only pity a person who falls back on a single word  ‘strengthen’ without anything concrete to be shown.

  • Contradhongi

     Hi, Rustom,

    So refreshing (!) to read your same old stuff after a long
    time gap. Just as you cannot resist doing a cut paste job from your manuscripts
    etched on dry banana leaf, I too cannot 
    resist help  broadening  our respective horizons  exchanging thought provoking ideas which
    please consider. I have read your ‘short sighted’ critics saying  that your are mere big time talker and in
    reality a non performer. With this my suggestion, you will be able to silence
    your ‘jealous’ critics for good. Unfortunately, I am not a Harvard Scholar with
    whom you are  accustomed to interact
    usually.

    I suggest that since you say that conditions in Mahuwa
    are  just right for Vulture breeding, why
     not start a campaign to shift the Bombay
    Towers of Silence to Mahuwa. Start a signature campaign or an online petition.
    The move will be a blessing for many a faltoo Ervards to relocate to Mahuwa for
    gainful ‘ashodads’. Simultaneously, ask B.P.P. where you seem to  be having considerable clout, to convert
    existing Bombay Towers of Silence into a Helipad and purchase a helicopter to
    ferry the corpse, mourners and “pure’ Parsee” pall bearers  to Mahuwa. In the process  you will generate  employment for  a Parsee  pilot rendered redundant by Kingfisher or Air
    India and you will earn countless blessings. You may even propose a larger
    aircraft (run on CNG) to BPP or W.Z.O. (India) and ask them to start a  Senior Citizens Home so that very old and sickly
    mourners can stay back  in  Mahuwa and spare incurring Air Fare later. All
    in all it will be a win win situation and most importantly  those who run you down, will be silenced
    beyond disbelief. Even I and others like me too will  be left with nothing to comment  so will have to bore ourselves  watch Mr.Bean on You Tube instead.

    Once this simple thing is accomplished by a versatile person
    such as you, all  part time Ervards
    can  live happily ever after.

    Out of curiosity and thirst for learning from an eminent
    Scholar of your standing, may I ask a simple question. No offence meant . You have
    quoted that “Vultures come under
    schedule (1) of the Wildlife Protection Act. “
    Pray please enlighten me, under which schedule endangered species of our  Parsee community find a place?

    For the benefit of the community, I am going to release this
    text by E Mail to other Jathostees to 
    provide them food for thought and request some of my friends on Facebook
    to reproduce the same This will  bring  well deserved fame and name Rustom will be on
    the lips of all living Parsees.

    With my best wishes and advanced congratulations on project
    Mahuwa.

    Ever sincerely yours,

    Contradhongi.

     

  • Contradhongi

     Hi, Rustom,

    So refreshing (!) to read your same old stuff after a long
    time gap. Just as you cannot resist doing a cut paste job from your manuscripts
    etched on dry banana leaf, I too cannot 
    resist help  broadening  our respective horizons  exchanging thought provoking ideas which
    please consider. I have read your ‘short sighted’ critics saying  that your are mere big time talker and in
    reality a non performer. With this my suggestion, you will be able to silence
    your ‘jealous’ critics for good. Unfortunately, I am not a Harvard Scholar with
    whom you are  accustomed to interact
    usually.

    I suggest that since you say that conditions in Mahuwa
    are  just right for Vulture breeding, why
     not start a campaign to shift the Bombay
    Towers of Silence to Mahuwa. Start a signature campaign or an online petition.
    The move will be a blessing for many a faltoo Ervards to relocate to Mahuwa for
    gainful ‘ashodads’. Simultaneously, ask B.P.P. where you seem to  be having considerable clout, to convert
    existing Bombay Towers of Silence into a Helipad and purchase a helicopter to
    ferry the corpse, mourners and “pure’ Parsee” pall bearers  to Mahuwa. In the process  you will generate  employment for  a Parsee  pilot rendered redundant by Kingfisher or Air
    India and you will earn countless blessings. You may even propose a larger
    aircraft (run on CNG) to BPP or W.Z.O. (India) and ask them to start a  Senior Citizens Home so that very old and sickly
    mourners can stay back  in  Mahuwa and spare incurring Air Fare later. All
    in all it will be a win win situation and most importantly  those who run you down, will be silenced
    beyond disbelief. Even I and others like me too will  be left with nothing to comment  so will have to bore ourselves  watch Mr.Bean on You Tube instead.

    Once this simple thing is accomplished by a versatile person
    such as you, all  part time Ervards
    can  live happily ever after.

    Out of curiosity and thirst for learning from an eminent
    Scholar of your standing, may I ask a simple question. No offence meant . You have
    quoted that “Vultures come under
    schedule (1) of the Wildlife Protection Act. “
    Pray please enlighten me, under which schedule endangered species of our  Parsee community find a place?

    For the benefit of the community, I am going to release this
    text by E Mail to other Jathostees to 
    provide them food for thought and request some of my friends on Facebook
    to reproduce the same This will  bring  well deserved fame and name Rustom will be on
    the lips of all living Parsees.

    With my best wishes and advanced congratulations on project
    Mahuwa.

    Ever sincerely yours,

    Contradhongi.

     

  • Contradhongi

     Hi, Rustom,

    So refreshing (!) to read your same old stuff after a long
    time gap. Just as you cannot resist doing a cut paste job from your manuscripts
    etched on dry banana leaf, I too cannot 
    resist help  broadening  our respective horizons  exchanging thought provoking ideas which
    please consider. I have read your ‘short sighted’ critics saying  that your are mere big time talker and in
    reality a non performer. With this my suggestion, you will be able to silence
    your ‘jealous’ critics for good. Unfortunately, I am not a Harvard Scholar with
    whom you are  accustomed to interact
    usually.

    I suggest that since you say that conditions in Mahuwa
    are  just right for Vulture breeding, why
     not start a campaign to shift the Bombay
    Towers of Silence to Mahuwa. Start a signature campaign or an online petition.
    The move will be a blessing for many a faltoo Ervards to relocate to Mahuwa for
    gainful ‘ashodads’. Simultaneously, ask B.P.P. where you seem to  be having considerable clout, to convert
    existing Bombay Towers of Silence into a Helipad and purchase a helicopter to
    ferry the corpse, mourners and “pure’ Parsee” pall bearers  to Mahuwa. In the process  you will generate  employment for  a Parsee  pilot rendered redundant by Kingfisher or Air
    India and you will earn countless blessings. You may even propose a larger
    aircraft (run on CNG) to BPP or W.Z.O. (India) and ask them to start a  Senior Citizens Home so that very old and sickly
    mourners can stay back  in  Mahuwa and spare incurring Air Fare later. All
    in all it will be a win win situation and most importantly  those who run you down, will be silenced
    beyond disbelief. Even I and others like me too will  be left with nothing to comment  so will have to bore ourselves  watch Mr.Bean on You Tube instead.

    Once this simple thing is accomplished by a versatile person
    such as you, all  part time Ervards
    can  live happily ever after.

    Out of curiosity and thirst for learning from an eminent
    Scholar of your standing, may I ask a simple question. No offence meant . You have
    quoted that “Vultures come under
    schedule (1) of the Wildlife Protection Act. “
    Pray please enlighten me, under which schedule endangered species of our  Parsee community find a place?

    For the benefit of the community, I am going to release this
    text by E Mail to other Jathostees to 
    provide them food for thought and request some of my friends on Facebook
    to reproduce the same This will  bring  well deserved fame and name Rustom will be on
    the lips of all living Parsees.

    With my best wishes and advanced congratulations on project
    Mahuwa.

    Ever sincerely yours,

    Contradhongi.

     

  • Contradhongi

    Hi, Rustom,

    So refreshing (!) to read your same old stuff after a long
    time gap. Just as you cannot resist doing a cut paste job from your manuscripts
    etched on dry banana leaf, I too cannot 
    resist help  broadening  our respective horizons  exchanging thought provoking ideas which
    please consider. I have read your ‘short sighted’ critics saying  that your are mere big time talker and in
    reality a non performer. With this my suggestion, you will be able to silence
    your ‘jealous’ critics for good. Unfortunately, I am not a Harvard Scholar with
    whom you are  accustomed to interact
    usually.

    I suggest that since you say that conditions in Mahuwa
    are  just right for Vulture breeding, why
     not start a campaign to shift the Bombay
    Towers of Silence to Mahuwa. Start a signature campaign or an online petition.
    The move will be a blessing for many a faltoo Ervards to relocate to Mahuwa for
    gainful ‘ashodads’. Simultaneously, ask B.P.P. where you seem to  be having considerable clout, to convert
    existing Bombay Towers of Silence into a Helipad and purchase a helicopter to
    ferry the corpse, mourners and “pure’ Parsee” pall bearers  to Mahuwa. In the process  you will generate  employment for  a Parsee  pilot rendered redundant by Kingfisher or Air
    India and you will earn countless blessings. You may even propose a larger
    aircraft (run on CNG) to BPP or W.Z.O. (India) and ask them to start a  Senior Citizens Home so that very old and sickly
    mourners can stay back  in  Mahuwa and spare incurring Air Fare later. All
    in all it will be a win win situation and most importantly  those who run you down, will be silenced
    beyond disbelief. Even I and others like me too will  be left with nothing to comment  so will have to bore ourselves  watch Mr.Bean on You Tube instead.

    Once this simple thing is accomplished by a versatile person
    such as you, all  part time Ervards
    can  live happily ever after.

    Out of curiosity and thirst for learning from an eminent
    Scholar of your standing, may I ask a simple question. No offence meant . You have
    quoted that “Vultures come under
    schedule (1) of the Wildlife Protection Act. “
    Pray please enlighten me, under which schedule endangered species of our  Parsee community find a place?

    For the benefit of the community, I am going to release this
    text by E Mail to other Jathostees to 
    provide them food for thought and request some of my friends on Facebook
    to reproduce the same This will  bring  well deserved fame and name Rustom will be on
    the lips of all living Parsees.

    With my best wishes and advanced congratulations on project
    Mahuwa.

    Ever sincerely yours,

    Contradhongi.

  • Contradhongi

    Hi, Rustom,

    So refreshing (!) to read your same old stuff after a long
    time gap. Just as you cannot resist doing a cut paste job from your manuscripts
    etched on dry banana leaf, I too cannot 
    resist help  broadening  our respective horizons  exchanging thought provoking ideas which
    please consider. I have read your ‘short sighted’ critics saying  that your are mere big time talker and in
    reality a non performer. With this my suggestion, you will be able to silence
    your ‘jealous’ critics for good. Unfortunately, I am not a Harvard Scholar with
    whom you are  accustomed to interact
    usually.

    I suggest that since you say that conditions in Mahuwa
    are  just right for Vulture breeding, why
     not start a campaign to shift the Bombay
    Towers of Silence to Mahuwa. Start a signature campaign or an online petition.
    The move will be a blessing for many a faltoo Ervards to relocate to Mahuwa for
    gainful ‘ashodads’. Simultaneously, ask B.P.P. where you seem to  be having considerable clout, to convert
    existing Bombay Towers of Silence into a Helipad and purchase a helicopter to
    ferry the corpse, mourners and “pure’ Parsee” pall bearers  to Mahuwa. In the process  you will generate  employment for  a Parsee  pilot rendered redundant by Kingfisher or Air
    India and you will earn countless blessings. You may even propose a larger
    aircraft (run on CNG) to BPP or W.Z.O. (India) and ask them to start a  Senior Citizens Home so that very old and sickly
    mourners can stay back  in  Mahuwa and spare incurring Air Fare later. All
    in all it will be a win win situation and most importantly  those who run you down, will be silenced
    beyond disbelief. Even I and others like me too will  be left with nothing to comment  so will have to bore ourselves  watch Mr.Bean on You Tube instead.

    Once this simple thing is accomplished by a versatile person
    such as you, all  part time Ervards
    can  live happily ever after.

    Out of curiosity and thirst for learning from an eminent
    Scholar of your standing, may I ask a simple question. No offence meant . You have
    quoted that “Vultures come under
    schedule (1) of the Wildlife Protection Act. “
    Pray please enlighten me, under which schedule endangered species of our  Parsee community find a place?

    For the benefit of the community, I am going to release this
    text by E Mail to other Jathostees to 
    provide them food for thought and request some of my friends on Facebook
    to reproduce the same This will  bring  well deserved fame and name Rustom will be on
    the lips of all living Parsees.

    With my best wishes and advanced congratulations on project
    Mahuwa.

    Ever sincerely yours,

    Contradhongi.

  • Rustom

    Dhongi….your first line indicates your wisdom…you say’  read your same old stuff again”…well firstly the posts that i have submitted were of the 29 and 31st may 2012…so they cannot be the same old ones..secondly..if you are referring to the topic of success of vulture conservation …well since the time of planning vulture aviaries you criticized it and now that they have taken to the skies by successful breeding , you still are adamant that they are no good..so keep on crying, and finding loopholes……….as far as your linking it with cng aircrafts etc etc..it shows your thirst and frustrations at your own failure…

    As far as cutting and pasting jobs from articles…i guess your wisdom will be tell everyone else not to read articles and papers as they are printed, copies from main source, and basically spread ignorance..i believe you have the right to your opinion and do please ignore newspaper and other articles..infact even malign the authors of such as they have reported the facts…

    and you last lines of spreading the sucess of vulture breeding programes ..i dont think you have the gall in you to do it without manipulating it…cause your writings and your groups show that your ego wont let you believe the success of vulture breeding programs nor will your thirst to end dokhmenishini end…nor will you be able to take up on any challenge to build on it but will fight tooth and nail to end it..just as you were ingorous to the health hazards of cremation and burial…..your other frivolous tirade is ignored as always..and hey what happened to the tactic of mass comment submitting to sort of hide factual reports…

  • Rustom

    Dhongi….your first line indicates your wisdom…you say’  read your same old stuff again”…well firstly the posts that i have submitted were of the 29 and 31st may 2012…so they cannot be the same old ones..secondly..if you are referring to the topic of success of vulture conservation …well since the time of planning vulture aviaries you criticized it and now that they have taken to the skies by successful breeding , you still are adamant that they are no good..so keep on crying, and finding loopholes……….as far as your linking it with cng aircrafts etc etc..it shows your thirst and frustrations at your own failure…

    As far as cutting and pasting jobs from articles…i guess your wisdom will be tell everyone else not to read articles and papers as they are printed, copies from main source, and basically spread ignorance..i believe you have the right to your opinion and do please ignore newspaper and other articles..infact even malign the authors of such as they have reported the facts…

    and you last lines of spreading the sucess of vulture breeding programes ..i dont think you have the gall in you to do it without manipulating it…cause your writings and your groups show that your ego wont let you believe the success of vulture breeding programs nor will your thirst to end dokhmenishini end…nor will you be able to take up on any challenge to build on it but will fight tooth and nail to end it..just as you were ingorous to the health hazards of cremation and burial…..your other frivolous tirade is ignored as always..and hey what happened to the tactic of mass comment submitting to sort of hide factual reports…

  • Contradhongi

    Rustom: Your reply shows, to use your own words ‘ thirst and frustration at your own ‘success’ (!). Experiments have no value till they are used for betterment of betterment of humanity.
    2) When do you propose to answer my .question “You havequoted that “Vultures come under schedule (1) of the Wildlife Protection Act. “
    Pray please enlighten me, under which schedule endangered species of our Parsee community find a place?
    Yours truly as always.

  • Contradhongi

    Rustom: Your reply shows, to use your own words ‘ thirst and frustration at your own ‘success’ (!). Experiments have no value till they are used for betterment of betterment of humanity.
    2) When do you propose to answer my .question “You havequoted that “Vultures come under schedule (1) of the Wildlife Protection Act. “
    Pray please enlighten me, under which schedule endangered species of our Parsee community find a place?
    Yours truly as always.

  • RATHESTAR

    The issue at stake cannot be resolved by Rustom or Contradhongee but by so labelled High Priests who have failed to show realistic vision and statesmanship and instead became instigators to B.P.P. for squandering money meant for Charity into pockets of Lawyers. Even now, though belatedly, these “Vada” Priests can allow performance of sacraments in Fire Temples regardless of mode of disposal as is being done in case of those residing abroad. This will pave the way for ending this controversy. But apparently, these Vada Priests want to face their Maker carrying the guilt of misguiding the community during their life time. With such an attitude, such senseless controversy will continue ad- infinitum.

  • RATHESTAR

    The issue at stake cannot be resolved by Rustom or Contradhongee but by so labelled High Priests who have failed to show realistic vision and statesmanship and instead became instigators to B.P.P. for squandering money meant for Charity into pockets of Lawyers. Even now, though belatedly, these “Vada” Priests can allow performance of sacraments in Fire Temples regardless of mode of disposal as is being done in case of those residing abroad. This will pave the way for ending this controversy. But apparently, these Vada Priests want to face their Maker carrying the guilt of misguiding the community during their life time. With such an attitude, such senseless controversy will continue ad- infinitum.

  • Zerxes

    Congrats Mr Kanga for your reply. You have rightly raised a pertinent point whether the conditions under which the birds have been bred in Mahuva, as cited by Rustom are identical to conditions in Mumbai.
    RUSTOM OUGHT TO MAKE IT CLEAR :
    1)If in depleted forest cover of Cumballa Hill the birds raised in captivity would survive ?
    OR
    2.) IS IT HIS INTENT THAT THE ENTIRE SET UP OF DOONGERWADI BE SHIFTED TO A REMOTE PLACE LIKE MAHUVA WITH ADEQUATE FOREST COVER.

    If it is latter , then I am afraid we are playing into the hands of land sharks and offer precious community grounds to builder lobby. We should strongly discourage proponents of such a move because they could be disguised agents of Builder lobby with an eye on making a fast buck from Charity property.

  • Zerxes

    Congrats Mr Kanga for your reply. You have rightly raised a pertinent point whether the conditions under which the birds have been bred in Mahuva, as cited by Rustom are identical to conditions in Mumbai.
    RUSTOM OUGHT TO MAKE IT CLEAR :
    1)If in depleted forest cover of Cumballa Hill the birds raised in captivity would survive ?
    OR
    2.) IS IT HIS INTENT THAT THE ENTIRE SET UP OF DOONGERWADI BE SHIFTED TO A REMOTE PLACE LIKE MAHUVA WITH ADEQUATE FOREST COVER.

    If it is latter , then I am afraid we are playing into the hands of land sharks and offer precious community grounds to builder lobby. We should strongly discourage proponents of such a move because they could be disguised agents of Builder lobby with an eye on making a fast buck from Charity property.

  • Byram

    @Phiroze: You parrot the same sentence that a student who fails to clear the exam utters viz. that he has not failed but the examiners who scrutinized his answers failed.

  • Byram

    @Phiroze: You parrot the same sentence that a student who fails to clear the exam utters viz. that he has not failed but the examiners who scrutinized his answers failed.

  • Shaimak.

    Demerits and drawbacks of cremation does not eliminate the fact that our existing practice is working and it would be foolhardy to say that we do not require an effective and a quick method of disposal.

  • Shaimak.

    Demerits and drawbacks of cremation does not eliminate the fact that our existing practice is working and it would be foolhardy to say that we do not require an effective and a quick method of disposal.

  • Er. Tehmool

    Well, I find nothing wrong if we can have a functional Dokhmaneshni system in Vasai on the outskirts of Mumbai which area is full of greenery and all types of Birds abound.B.P.P. can start halting rooms for relatives of the deceased. At least we will have a system that works.

  • Er. Tehmool

    Well, I find nothing wrong if we can have a functional Dokhmaneshni system in Vasai on the outskirts of Mumbai which area is full of greenery and all types of Birds abound.B.P.P. can start halting rooms for relatives of the deceased. At least we will have a system that works.

  • Er. Tehmool

    Well, I find nothing wrong if we can have a functional Dokhmaneshni system in Vasai on the outskirts of Mumbai which area is full of greenery and all types of Birds abound.B.P.P. can start halting rooms for relatives of the deceased. At least we will have a system that works.

  • Contradhongi

    Hi, Rustom,
    You have to clarify how the palm which ‘could have come from anywhere; there are two crematoriums in the vicinity” as stated by the “Learned Trustee”,. then how was the same palm consigned to Dakhma? Is it not a sacrilege?
    I am asking you as I have lot to learn from you.
    Sincerely yours ,
    CONTRADHONGI.

  • Contradhongi

    Hi, Rustom,
    You have to clarify how the palm which ‘could have come from anywhere; there are two crematoriums in the vicinity” as stated by the “Learned Trustee”,. then how was the same palm consigned to Dakhma? Is it not a sacrilege?
    I am asking you as I have lot to learn from you.
    Sincerely yours ,
    CONTRADHONGI.

  • Phiroze

    The question is if the reformists are willing to be consigned anywhere besides Cumballa hill. At present they are not willing to use crematoria provided by the MCGB all over Mumbai but insist on one at Doongerwadi/Cumballa hill only!!!!

  • Phiroze

    The question is if the reformists are willing to be consigned anywhere besides Cumballa hill. At present they are not willing to use crematoria provided by the MCGB all over Mumbai but insist on one at Doongerwadi/Cumballa hill only!!!!

  • Phiroze

    The question is if the reformists are willing to be consigned anywhere besides Cumballa hill. At present they are not willing to use crematoria provided by the MCGB all over Mumbai but insist on one at Doongerwadi/Cumballa hill only!!!!

  • F Kanga

    Phiroze, If you care to read Times of India /Parsiana (both in English), you will find a number of Parsees opting for cremation and where do they get cremated if not in Municipal Cremation grounds? if you know of cremation ground set up by B.P.P., please provide its address.
    You are totally off the mark when you say that all who want a working system of disposal of deaf bodies are REFORMISTS.
    Secondly you are wrong that all those who opted for cremation were pro cremation. They had to opt for cremation out of COMPULSION as burial facility is not provided by our community in Mumbai and our self styled High Priests and persons who have mortgaged their minds do not want to provide a supplementary system like Promession.
    One wiseacre who ceaselessly talks of Vulture Aviary and thought himself to be a genius by airing his views a couple of weeks ago in Parsee Press, got a point wise rebuttal of his tall claims and he has no face to give a rejoinder. It is amply clear that all those who find nothing bad about corpses rotting under present ‘system’ are mostly agents of Builders with an eye of prime property in prized Malabar Hill locality.

  • F Kanga

    Phiroze, If you care to read Times of India /Parsiana (both in English), you will find a number of Parsees opting for cremation and where do they get cremated if not in Municipal Cremation grounds? if you know of cremation ground set up by B.P.P., please provide its address.
    You are totally off the mark when you say that all who want a working system of disposal of deaf bodies are REFORMISTS.
    Secondly you are wrong that all those who opted for cremation were pro cremation. They had to opt for cremation out of COMPULSION as burial facility is not provided by our community in Mumbai and our self styled High Priests and persons who have mortgaged their minds do not want to provide a supplementary system like Promession.
    One wiseacre who ceaselessly talks of Vulture Aviary and thought himself to be a genius by airing his views a couple of weeks ago in Parsee Press, got a point wise rebuttal of his tall claims and he has no face to give a rejoinder. It is amply clear that all those who find nothing bad about corpses rotting under present ‘system’ are mostly agents of Builders with an eye of prime property in prized Malabar Hill locality.

  • Er. Tehmool

    I am not interested in what Reformists want. I am talking of shifting the present establishment to a place like Vasai, where birds of prey can survive.

  • Er. Tehmool

    I am not interested in what Reformists want. I am talking of shifting the present establishment to a place like Vasai, where birds of prey can survive.

  • Perveez Mistry

    “The system is working well and there has been no controversy for the last two-three years. Why resurrect it?” So said the BPP Trustee in March 2012. But now the same B.P.P. Trustee talks of Aviary being a necessity ? WHAT TRANSPIRED DURING THREE MONTHS TO JUSTIFY A CHANGE IN OPINION? My bies on the subject are herebelow:Since a few months much of newsprint has been ‘utilised’
    discussing a topic of least importance to the community, that of Aviary. To put
    an end to this seemingly endless controversy created by those whose ‘interests’
    are known to all, I have a simple suggestion.

    It is an undisputed fact that each Baug or Parsi Colony has
    population range between 500 to 2000 persons, whereas on reading FPJ
    Advertisement page, those supposed to be in favour of Aviary experiment range
    between three to twenty five persons per baug/colony. Since this ‘support’
    is canvassed, by implication those who have not yielded to such canvassing are
    numerically in thousands and can be construed as not in favour of this
    experiment.

    Since the proponents of this project want to project support to
    the experiment to be ‘overwhelming’ and since such ‘supporters’ address
    their “overwhelmingly numerical” support not to B.P.P. Trustees but
    to an organization to which two B.P.P. Trustees owe affiliation, I have one
    suggestion. In this scenario, would it not be just, and appropriate for B.P.P.
    to give a chance to the proponents of this experiment by
    handing over one Dakhma for say five years to carry out experiment entirely
    at the cost of the proponents themselves? Why should the entire
    community sacrifice Charity Funds to satisfy the obsession of such handful of
    individuals? If, after five years the project is found ‘feasible’, B.P.P. can
    take it over and reimburse the cost incurred by such zealots.

    To be honest, this is not my original idea but derives its
    inspiration from a message I read elsewhere on an online Petition.

    This transparent solution will provide a win – win
    situation for all, no allegations against the proponents and more importantly
    curtains down to this, what the fake orthodox consider as an
    ‘important issue.’

  • Perveez Mistry

    “The system is working well and there has been no controversy for the last two-three years. Why resurrect it?” So said the BPP Trustee in March 2012. But now the same B.P.P. Trustee talks of Aviary being a necessity ? WHAT TRANSPIRED DURING THREE MONTHS TO JUSTIFY A CHANGE IN OPINION? My bies on the subject are herebelow:Since a few months much of newsprint has been ‘utilised’
    discussing a topic of least importance to the community, that of Aviary. To put
    an end to this seemingly endless controversy created by those whose ‘interests’
    are known to all, I have a simple suggestion.

    It is an undisputed fact that each Baug or Parsi Colony has
    population range between 500 to 2000 persons, whereas on reading FPJ
    Advertisement page, those supposed to be in favour of Aviary experiment range
    between three to twenty five persons per baug/colony. Since this ‘support’
    is canvassed, by implication those who have not yielded to such canvassing are
    numerically in thousands and can be construed as not in favour of this
    experiment.

    Since the proponents of this project want to project support to
    the experiment to be ‘overwhelming’ and since such ‘supporters’ address
    their “overwhelmingly numerical” support not to B.P.P. Trustees but
    to an organization to which two B.P.P. Trustees owe affiliation, I have one
    suggestion. In this scenario, would it not be just, and appropriate for B.P.P.
    to give a chance to the proponents of this experiment by
    handing over one Dakhma for say five years to carry out experiment entirely
    at the cost of the proponents themselves? Why should the entire
    community sacrifice Charity Funds to satisfy the obsession of such handful of
    individuals? If, after five years the project is found ‘feasible’, B.P.P. can
    take it over and reimburse the cost incurred by such zealots.

    To be honest, this is not my original idea but derives its
    inspiration from a message I read elsewhere on an online Petition.

    This transparent solution will provide a win – win
    situation for all, no allegations against the proponents and more importantly
    curtains down to this, what the fake orthodox consider as an
    ‘important issue.’