Parsis living in the UK, USA and Canada are more conscious of their identity than their Mumbai counterparts. This statement would have been wholly incorrect, some forty years ago, in the 70’s. However, the position has altered dramatically in the last four decades. It was widely expected then (and correctly so) that the migrants would get assimilated in the culture of the host country and soon lose touch with the community in India.
By Bergis Desai | Mumbai Samachar
Interfaith marriages would be the norm, cremation and burial, without prayers, for the dead, no fire temples and no High Priests (what a blessing), no Jame Jamshed and no BPP (another, what a blessing), no Baugs and colonies and no Parsi nataks, no lagan nu bhonu and no Colaba Agiary, no heretic scum and no lunatic fringe. All the essential ingredients of Parsipanu (our Messiah’s favourite phrase) would be missing. The migrant would be inundated with foreign culture and ideas and norms and soon lose his identity.
While many of the ingredients are still missing, it has worked to the advantage of the migrants. Take the example of our good friend, Rustom Dubash, a senior partner of a leading English law firm, Rustom would have never even contemplated taking a lead in community affairs, if he was in Mumbai, disgusted that he would have been with the petty politics, unending litigation and ego wars among the leaders and their warring groups. However, he willingly carves out of precious professional time, space for community activities in the U.K. One can multiply many such examples.
The Parsis abroad are more united, cohesive, sensible and polite, unlike their Mumbai counterparts who drip aggression and ill-will. A cursory look at journals like Hamazor from the U.K. or the U.S. Fezana indicates the solid social work being done by Parsis abroad for their less fortunate brethren in India. There is hardly any polarization or extreme views. The liberal values of a Western democracy are absorbed and observed, in letter and in spirit. Of course, some goon or handa does surface occasionally but is soon forgotten or ignored. It is this moderation which makes way for compassionate co-existence in a celebratory mode. Obviously, there is gender equality in matters of interfaith marriages and non-Parsi spouses are warmly welcomed (and not made to feel like pariahs).
Our ancient heritage and culture is cherished and revered. Research scholars are honoured and acknowledged. The absence of busibodies, who take upon themselves to be defenders of the Faith and community institutions, greatly helps in maintaining cordiality and laying the foundation of socio-economic progress. To the extent possible, traditions are preserved. The lagan nu bhonu, served at many festival gatherings abroad, is authentic (and, of course, hygienic, as compared to the intestine petrifying stuff doled out locally).
The Parsi migrants have admirably preserved their identity and the resultant product is highly appealing to the young. In Mumbai, we have brutalized our sensibilities and we often behave like street fighters. The quiet dignity of the Parsis abroad is missing. Without doubt, they are a happier lot and display true Parsipanu.
Arzan, awesome thoughts. It truly mirrors the current situation. It is such a pleasure to read on the website than on facebook, cause its always so mud slinging and attacking on facebook inspite of your repeated reminders.
Arzan, awesome thoughts. It truly mirrors the current situation. It is such a pleasure to read on the website than on facebook, cause its always so mud slinging and attacking on facebook inspite of your repeated reminders.
Arzan, awesome thoughts. It truly mirrors the current situation. It is such a pleasure to read on the website than on facebook, cause its always so mud slinging and attacking on facebook inspite of your repeated reminders.
Replace abroad with outside Mumbai, u get the same result, u dont have to look far and wide
Replace abroad with outside Mumbai, u get the same result, u dont have to look far and wide
Dear Mr. Desai,This is with reference to your editorial, The Short View, in the PTA, Bombay Samachar, January 8, 2012.You declare: “Parsis living in the UK, USA and Canada are more conscious of their identity than their Mumbai counterparts.” Yes. The majority of Parsis in these regions are indeed consumed with maintaining their identity through chok-toran, lagan-nu bhonu, sari with tili ni kor or embroidered Swiss kor, achu-michu, sev, ravo and ses! There is no religious identity in these superfluous cultural paraphernalia! They wish to retain only the words, “Parsi-Irani Zarathushtis” because they know they will remain so in name only but not in any of the religious practises! It has often been quoted from “The Lessons of History”, written by Will and Ariel Durant that people “degenerate” due to “falling away from the genus”, meaning as a consequence of assimilation! And verily, our own groups who left Iran in the seventh century for western countries and China got assimilated by the third generation because they did not follow the religious mandates and preservation of our unique religious identity. Through assimilation, these groups have only left behind archaeological ruins to testify to their presence in these regions but there are no descendants who have been following the religion through centuries as the Parsis have been, outside of Iran. In UK, USA and Canada history is repeating itself! You have also stated that the Parsis abroad are a happier lot and display true Parsipanu. It depends what you describe as true Parsipanu. If it means discarding the mandated wearing of sureh-kusti, not performing rituals and getting cremated or buried is “happiness” then it is questionable as to what is happiness! If it makes any individual happy to do away with what the religion requires to be observed, if it means disobedience to religious laws to suit one’s whims or convenience, then it is not “happiness” we are talking about; it is only an expression of defiance on how to create discord within a religious community and promote disobedience to religious rules!If one breaks the ethical or civic laws laid by any particular government, punishment is obvious. What about the religious laws which also need to be obeyed? Irrefutably, religion is not a political democracy wherein individuals choose whatever aspects of the revealed teachings they wish to obey and discard the rest democratically! The so-called democracy tends to become an insatiable desire to deny the Prophet’s authority as well as the authority of the revealed scriptures for the sake of choice and convenience! Our religion does not offer the freedom to choose what we like through mental exertions because we are categorically taught that angre-mainyu or spiritual ignorance resides in the mind and that is why we are prescribed certain spiritual disciplines which cannot be done away with! None of us are perfected spiritually, is a fact! Therefore, ours is not to reason why or choose what to obey or discard but to follow the mandates of the religion of birth!Need it be said that religion is not man-made as democracy is? Religion is not studied and written down in a university through the study of books, but it is divinely revealed to the Appointed One through personal communion by the Almighty Himself. When religion, which should be the guiding principle in daily life, loses its importance, society becomes materialistic and begins to degenerate morally. Surely, the western nations are suffering from an over-doze of this ailment! Most of our own community members who have chosen to live in these regions are mimicking what other cultures and religions do! We are accepting whatever is spiritually wrong then justifying, rationalising and accepting these “choices of convenience” as “change” and “rights”. Nonetheless, it is ignored that “rights” come with moral/religious responsibilities!You also maintain that in the Western countries, “The Parsi migrants have admirably preserved their identity and the resultant product is highly appealing to the young.” Yes, to the young who do not know what our true religious identity is, who do not know our past history and who are fed on “do as you please” and “freedom to choose” what they, in their religious ignorance, think is convenient to them! Majority of youth today do not wear the mandated sudreh-kusti. Then how can they recite any prayers without first performing the kusti-padyab ritual? They cannot and what is life if there is no time or place to think of the Creator and offer thanks for all the bounties given to us? Our youth do not believe that religious laws are revealed. If arbitrarily altered, religion is debased into a “cult”, devoid of spiritual revelation. Therefore, consensus to alter religious laws through democratic changes destroys the spirituality of any established religion. Our relationship with Ahura Mazda is through the spiritual disciplines mandated to us by Asho Zarathushtra and these include much more than mere good thoughts, words and deeds!If languages become obsolete if not spoken; if animal species die because their habitat and environment change as a result of mankind’s disrespect of Nature’s intricately balanced laws of ecology; can any religion survive if its spiritual laws are not adhered to, its rituals/traditions either forgotten or changed or “reformed” to suit societal trends which are not always progressive or conducive to spiritual growth? No. By preserving our rituals and traditions we have survived in India, and we will continue to survive as long as we continue to preserve and follow the “closed door” policy which has ensured our survival till today. Please, let us not forget the lessons of our own past history and the lessons the other communities, such as the Jewish community, are teaching us even today!Mr. Desai, you should ask any Christian if their religion will survive without churches and priests. The answer will be no! Ask any Jewish follower if their religion will survive without synagogues and Rabi and let us hear what they tell you! Will the Muslims survive without their mosques or mullahs; or the Hindus, without their temples and priests? No! Then why would you think that our religion will survive without the priests and consecrated places of worship in any area in the world? And because interfaith marriages have become the norm, after 40 years of promoting such interfaith marriages, one official of FEZANA has publicly lamented the fact that FEZANA has promoted intermarriages for the past 40 years and we have done everything possible to accept and encourage the progeny to stay within our community and religion but the progeny does not take to our religion and this way we are losing our numbers; not gaining Zarathushtis! This was said at a public Get-Together Meeting in 2008. This is irrefutable and can be verified. Hats off to my friend who accepted this fact because it took honesty and courage to reveal the truth!Please never forget that our (including your) ancestors sealed their fate in blood to protect and preserve our mandated spiritual disciplines. After the Arab conquest of Iran, during the worst days the Zarathushtis faced, they did not marry Muslims to remain in Iran and save their own lives. These sagacious forefathers cared more for the preservation of religion than their own life. Are we worthy of being their descendants if we now alter our rituals, scriptures, traditions just to suit those who have willingly departed from the religious disciplines for the sake of convenience and change? No! And last but not the least, thank you for referring to the real believers who are simply following the religious mandates – as have been followed for millennia – by our ancestors, as “fruit cakes”! Fruit cakes are the best and that is why they are served at weddings and at seasonal festivals, including at X’Mas time! The hypocrites may be the lunatic fringe you mention but the followers are the real rich (in spirituality) “fruit cakes”! These are sincere, devoted Parsis who wish to follow their religion unaltered! Is that a crime? No! No court of law will describe this as a crime! Neither should any reformist ridicule a traditionalist! We, the traditionalists, follow the well-trodden path of our ancestors and will not become history! A staunch follower, Pervin J. Mistry.
While I respect the fact that Parsis outside of Mumbai do great work in order to flock together and are conscious of their identity, most of them are far more tolerant and midle-of-the road than author Burjis Desai who has obviously the most bigoted views about the Community in Mumbai. This could be because he might have been jilted in love for the city where he grew up and built a prosperous legal practice. My advice to him is – don’t spit in the plate you eat in.
CONGRATULATIONS our Humdins Abroad.as the sayig goes: “PRAY To-gather, EAT To-gather, WORK n PLAY To-gather, as many times as possible. KEEPS US To-gather.”
I have observed over a period various nationalities converging to Pune in large numbers basically for education and work experience, etc. among all these various nationalities the Palestanians stood out far above everyone especially in trouble. Even if one of them would get into trouble, within NO time anything from 20-40 2-whlrs. with 2-3 on a bike would land up to help. Fantastic unity.
Hope our Hamdins do and act similarly to help out one in need.
GOD BLESS YOU ALL!!!
CONGRATULATIONS our Humdins Abroad.as the sayig goes: “PRAY To-gather, EAT To-gather, WORK n PLAY To-gather, as many times as possible. KEEPS US To-gather.”
I have observed over a period various nationalities converging to Pune in large numbers basically for education and work experience, etc. among all these various nationalities the Palestanians stood out far above everyone especially in trouble. Even if one of them would get into trouble, within NO time anything from 20-40 2-whlrs. with 2-3 on a bike would land up to help. Fantastic unity.
Hope our Hamdins do and act similarly to help out one in need.
GOD BLESS YOU ALL!!!
Dear Mr. Desai,This is with reference to your editorial, The Short View, in the PTA, Bombay Samachar, January 8, 2012.You declare: “Parsis living in the UK, USA and Canada are more conscious of their identity than their Mumbai counterparts.” Yes. The majority of Parsis in these regions are indeed consumed with maintaining their identity through chok-toran, lagan-nu bhonu, sari with tili ni kor or embroidered Swiss kor, achu-michu, sev, ravo and ses! There is no religious identity in these superfluous cultural paraphernalia! They wish to retain only the words, “Parsi-Irani Zarathushtis” because they know they will remain so in name only but not in any of the religious practises! It has often been quoted from “The Lessons of History”, written by Will and Ariel Durant that people “degenerate” due to “falling away from the genus”, meaning as a consequence of assimilation! And verily, our own groups who left Iran in the seventh century for western countries and China got assimilated by the third generation because they did not follow the religious mandates and preservation of our unique religious identity. Through assimilation, these groups have only left behind archaeological ruins to testify to their presence in these regions but there are no descendants who have been following the religion through centuries as the Parsis have been, outside of Iran. In UK, USA and Canada history is repeating itself! You have also stated that the Parsis abroad are a happier lot and display true Parsipanu. It depends what you describe as true Parsipanu. If it means discarding the mandated wearing of sureh-kusti, not performing rituals and getting cremated or buried is “happiness” then it is questionable as to what is happiness! If it makes any individual happy to do away with what the religion requires to be observed, if it means disobedience to religious laws to suit one’s whims or convenience, then it is not “happiness” we are talking about; it is only an expression of defiance on how to create discord within a religious community and promote disobedience to religious rules!If one breaks the ethical or civic laws laid by any particular government, punishment is obvious. What about the religious laws which also need to be obeyed? Irrefutably, religion is not a political democracy wherein individuals choose whatever aspects of the revealed teachings they wish to obey and discard the rest democratically! The so-called democracy tends to become an insatiable desire to deny the Prophet’s authority as well as the authority of the revealed scriptures for the sake of choice and convenience! Our religion does not offer the freedom to choose what we like through mental exertions because we are categorically taught that angre-mainyu or spiritual ignorance resides in the mind and that is why we are prescribed certain spiritual disciplines which cannot be done away with! None of us are perfected spiritually, is a fact! Therefore, ours is not to reason why or choose what to obey or discard but to follow the mandates of the religion of birth!Need it be said that religion is not man-made as democracy is? Religion is not studied and written down in a university through the study of books, but it is divinely revealed to the Appointed One through personal communion by the Almighty Himself. When religion, which should be the guiding principle in daily life, loses its importance, society becomes materialistic and begins to degenerate morally. Surely, the western nations are suffering from an over-doze of this ailment! Most of our own community members who have chosen to live in these regions are mimicking what other cultures and religions do! We are accepting whatever is spiritually wrong then justifying, rationalising and accepting these “choices of convenience” as “change” and “rights”. Nonetheless, it is ignored that “rights” come with moral/religious responsibilities!You also maintain that in the Western countries, “The Parsi migrants have admirably preserved their identity and the resultant product is highly appealing to the young.” Yes, to the young who do not know what our true religious identity is, who do not know our past history and who are fed on “do as you please” and “freedom to choose” what they, in their religious ignorance, think is convenient to them! Majority of youth today do not wear the mandated sudreh-kusti. Then how can they recite any prayers without first performing the kusti-padyab ritual? They cannot and what is life if there is no time or place to think of the Creator and offer thanks for all the bounties given to us? Our youth do not believe that religious laws are revealed. If arbitrarily altered, religion is debased into a “cult”, devoid of spiritual revelation. Therefore, consensus to alter religious laws through democratic changes destroys the spirituality of any established religion. Our relationship with Ahura Mazda is through the spiritual disciplines mandated to us by Asho Zarathushtra and these include much more than mere good thoughts, words and deeds!If languages become obsolete if not spoken; if animal species die because their habitat and environment change as a result of mankind’s disrespect of Nature’s intricately balanced laws of ecology; can any religion survive if its spiritual laws are not adhered to, its rituals/traditions either forgotten or changed or “reformed” to suit societal trends which are not always progressive or conducive to spiritual growth? No. By preserving our rituals and traditions we have survived in India, and we will continue to survive as long as we continue to preserve and follow the “closed door” policy which has ensured our survival till today. Please, let us not forget the lessons of our own past history and the lessons the other communities, such as the Jewish community, are teaching us even today!Mr. Desai, you should ask any Christian if their religion will survive without churches and priests. The answer will be no! Ask any Jewish follower if their religion will survive without synagogues and Rabi and let us hear what they tell you! Will the Muslims survive without their mosques or mullahs; or the Hindus, without their temples and priests? No! Then why would you think that our religion will survive without the priests and consecrated places of worship in any area in the world? And because interfaith marriages have become the norm, after 40 years of promoting such interfaith marriages, one official of FEZANA has publicly lamented the fact that FEZANA has promoted intermarriages for the past 40 years and we have done everything possible to accept and encourage the progeny to stay within our community and religion but the progeny does not take to our religion and this way we are losing our numbers; not gaining Zarathushtis! This was said at a public Get-Together Meeting in 2008. This is irrefutable and can be verified. Hats off to my friend who accepted this fact because it took honesty and courage to reveal the truth!Please never forget that our (including your) ancestors sealed their fate in blood to protect and preserve our mandated spiritual disciplines. After the Arab conquest of Iran, during the worst days the Zarathushtis faced, they did not marry Muslims to remain in Iran and save their own lives. These sagacious forefathers cared more for the preservation of religion than their own life. Are we worthy of being their descendants if we now alter our rituals, scriptures, traditions just to suit those who have willingly departed from the religious disciplines for the sake of convenience and change? No! And last but not the least, thank you for referring to the real believers who are simply following the religious mandates – as have been followed for millennia – by our ancestors, as “fruit cakes”! Fruit cakes are the best and that is why they are served at weddings and at seasonal festivals, including at X’Mas time! The hypocrites may be the lunatic fringe you mention but the followers are the real rich (in spirituality) “fruit cakes”! These are sincere, devoted Parsis who wish to follow their religion unaltered! Is that a crime? No! No court of law will describe this as a crime! Neither should any reformist ridicule a traditionalist! We, the traditionalists, follow the well-trodden path of our ancestors and will not become history! A staunch follower, Pervin J. Mistry.
Dear Mr. Desai,This is with reference to your editorial, The Short View, in the PTA, Bombay Samachar, January 8, 2012.You declare: “Parsis living in the UK, USA and Canada are more conscious of their identity than their Mumbai counterparts.” Yes. The majority of Parsis in these regions are indeed consumed with maintaining their identity through chok-toran, lagan-nu bhonu, sari with tili ni kor or embroidered Swiss kor, achu-michu, sev, ravo and ses! There is no religious identity in these superfluous cultural paraphernalia! They wish to retain only the words, “Parsi-Irani Zarathushtis” because they know they will remain so in name only but not in any of the religious practises! It has often been quoted from “The Lessons of History”, written by Will and Ariel Durant that people “degenerate” due to “falling away from the genus”, meaning as a consequence of assimilation! And verily, our own groups who left Iran in the seventh century for western countries and China got assimilated by the third generation because they did not follow the religious mandates and preservation of our unique religious identity. Through assimilation, these groups have only left behind archaeological ruins to testify to their presence in these regions but there are no descendants who have been following the religion through centuries as the Parsis have been, outside of Iran. In UK, USA and Canada history is repeating itself! You have also stated that the Parsis abroad are a happier lot and display true Parsipanu. It depends what you describe as true Parsipanu. If it means discarding the mandated wearing of sureh-kusti, not performing rituals and getting cremated or buried is “happiness” then it is questionable as to what is happiness! If it makes any individual happy to do away with what the religion requires to be observed, if it means disobedience to religious laws to suit one’s whims or convenience, then it is not “happiness” we are talking about; it is only an expression of defiance on how to create discord within a religious community and promote disobedience to religious rules!If one breaks the ethical or civic laws laid by any particular government, punishment is obvious. What about the religious laws which also need to be obeyed? Irrefutably, religion is not a political democracy wherein individuals choose whatever aspects of the revealed teachings they wish to obey and discard the rest democratically! The so-called democracy tends to become an insatiable desire to deny the Prophet’s authority as well as the authority of the revealed scriptures for the sake of choice and convenience! Our religion does not offer the freedom to choose what we like through mental exertions because we are categorically taught that angre-mainyu or spiritual ignorance resides in the mind and that is why we are prescribed certain spiritual disciplines which cannot be done away with! None of us are perfected spiritually, is a fact! Therefore, ours is not to reason why or choose what to obey or discard but to follow the mandates of the religion of birth!Need it be said that religion is not man-made as democracy is? Religion is not studied and written down in a university through the study of books, but it is divinely revealed to the Appointed One through personal communion by the Almighty Himself. When religion, which should be the guiding principle in daily life, loses its importance, society becomes materialistic and begins to degenerate morally. Surely, the western nations are suffering from an over-doze of this ailment! Most of our own community members who have chosen to live in these regions are mimicking what other cultures and religions do! We are accepting whatever is spiritually wrong then justifying, rationalising and accepting these “choices of convenience” as “change” and “rights”. Nonetheless, it is ignored that “rights” come with moral/religious responsibilities!You also maintain that in the Western countries, “The Parsi migrants have admirably preserved their identity and the resultant product is highly appealing to the young.” Yes, to the young who do not know what our true religious identity is, who do not know our past history and who are fed on “do as you please” and “freedom to choose” what they, in their religious ignorance, think is convenient to them! Majority of youth today do not wear the mandated sudreh-kusti. Then how can they recite any prayers without first performing the kusti-padyab ritual? They cannot and what is life if there is no time or place to think of the Creator and offer thanks for all the bounties given to us? Our youth do not believe that religious laws are revealed. If arbitrarily altered, religion is debased into a “cult”, devoid of spiritual revelation. Therefore, consensus to alter religious laws through democratic changes destroys the spirituality of any established religion. Our relationship with Ahura Mazda is through the spiritual disciplines mandated to us by Asho Zarathushtra and these include much more than mere good thoughts, words and deeds!If languages become obsolete if not spoken; if animal species die because their habitat and environment change as a result of mankind’s disrespect of Nature’s intricately balanced laws of ecology; can any religion survive if its spiritual laws are not adhered to, its rituals/traditions either forgotten or changed or “reformed” to suit societal trends which are not always progressive or conducive to spiritual growth? No. By preserving our rituals and traditions we have survived in India, and we will continue to survive as long as we continue to preserve and follow the “closed door” policy which has ensured our survival till today. Please, let us not forget the lessons of our own past history and the lessons the other communities, such as the Jewish community, are teaching us even today!Mr. Desai, you should ask any Christian if their religion will survive without churches and priests. The answer will be no! Ask any Jewish follower if their religion will survive without synagogues and Rabi and let us hear what they tell you! Will the Muslims survive without their mosques or mullahs; or the Hindus, without their temples and priests? No! Then why would you think that our religion will survive without the priests and consecrated places of worship in any area in the world? And because interfaith marriages have become the norm, after 40 years of promoting such interfaith marriages, one official of FEZANA has publicly lamented the fact that FEZANA has promoted intermarriages for the past 40 years and we have done everything possible to accept and encourage the progeny to stay within our community and religion but the progeny does not take to our religion and this way we are losing our numbers; not gaining Zarathushtis! This was said at a public Get-Together Meeting in 2008. This is irrefutable and can be verified. Hats off to my friend who accepted this fact because it took honesty and courage to reveal the truth!Please never forget that our (including your) ancestors sealed their fate in blood to protect and preserve our mandated spiritual disciplines. After the Arab conquest of Iran, during the worst days the Zarathushtis faced, they did not marry Muslims to remain in Iran and save their own lives. These sagacious forefathers cared more for the preservation of religion than their own life. Are we worthy of being their descendants if we now alter our rituals, scriptures, traditions just to suit those who have willingly departed from the religious disciplines for the sake of convenience and change? No! And last but not the least, thank you for referring to the real believers who are simply following the religious mandates – as have been followed for millennia – by our ancestors, as “fruit cakes”! Fruit cakes are the best and that is why they are served at weddings and at seasonal festivals, including at X’Mas time! The hypocrites may be the lunatic fringe you mention but the followers are the real rich (in spirituality) “fruit cakes”! These are sincere, devoted Parsis who wish to follow their religion unaltered! Is that a crime? No! No court of law will describe this as a crime! Neither should any reformist ridicule a traditionalist! We, the traditionalists, follow the well-trodden path of our ancestors and will not become history! A staunch follower, Pervin J. Mistry.
While I respect the fact that Parsis outside of Mumbai do great work in order to flock together and are conscious of their identity, most of them are far more tolerant and midle-of-the road than author Burjis Desai who has obviously the most bigoted views about the Community in Mumbai. This could be because he might have been jilted in love for the city where he grew up and built a prosperous legal practice. My advice to him is – don’t spit in the plate you eat in.
While I respect the fact that Parsis outside of Mumbai do great work in order to flock together and are conscious of their identity, most of them are far more tolerant and midle-of-the road than author Burjis Desai who has obviously the most bigoted views about the Community in Mumbai. This could be because he might have been jilted in love for the city where he grew up and built a prosperous legal practice. My advice to him is – don’t spit in the plate you eat in.
I have had the misfortune to attend a few so called Parsi religious functions in UK US HK and found 90% of the females gathered there without the Sudreh and Kusti in trying to be progressively fashionable. Does the author seriously think this is true Parsipanu????? No I am not MCP but just that the males were fully clothed. Is he really serious when he says they are happier because of it????. If this were so why have such Parsis, after so many years of trying, still struggling to establish a working Agiary. Pls note I am not talking of a Darbe-Meher where the fire is lit when someone finds time to offer a prayer but a 24 x 7 working Agiary bustling with daily rituals and activities.
I KNOW OF MANY A PARSEE FAMILIES- BOTH HUBBY & WIFE BEING PARSEE ZOROASTRIANS SETTLED IN THE WEST BUT RELIGIOUS MINDED TO THE CORE. THEY GET THEIR SUDRAS AND KUSTIS FROM IN INDIA. THEREFORE IT IS HIGHLY PRESUMPTIVE AND BORDERS ON ARROGANCE TO INSINUATE THAT JUST BECAUSE THERE IS ABSENCE OF CONSECRATED FIRE TEMPLE IN THE WEST, THE CONCERNED PARSEES HAVE LOST THEIR “PARSIPANU’ TO ME THE IMPRESSION IS THAT PERSONS HOWLING FROM THE ROOFTOPS THAT THEY ARE TRADITIONAL AND ORTHODOX ASSUME THAT THEY ARE TORCH BEARERS OF THE FAITH. PERHAPS TO SUCH INDIVIDUALS A PARSEE FROM INDIA MARRIED TO A PERSON FROM ANOTHER FAITH IS A BETTER INDIVIDUAL THAN A PARSEE MARRIED WITHIN FOLD BUT RESIDING ABROAD. RELIGIOUS PRINCIPLES O OUR FAITH ARE TO BE PRACTICED IN REAL DAY TO DAY LIFE AND ARE NOT CONFINED TO JUST RECITING PRAYERS IN A FIRE TEMPLE.
It looks like Parsees settled abroad are more UNITED amongst themselves than we in mumbai.
Thank you Ms. Pervin Mistry . I wish to convey my deepest appreciation of your very apt and no nonsense reply. Nozer
The way I see it, a religion which doesn’t let you think freely is more of a confinement unit than a way of living. If people are true believers just by wearing the mandated sudreh-kusti and reciting a bunch of prayers, then I guess faith is just a placebo for having a God. Its not faith that keeps you going astray, its fear. Fear of God and fear of falling off the plank.
If religion can’t teach you to be moral and just because of the nature of it, then its not doing the job right. You tell me who is better, a god fearing person, with faith, refraining from crimes as it will lead to falling of a razor sharp Chinvat or a follower who chooses convinience and practicality and refuses to commit a crime just because its not right?
Every version of religion has its followers and fanatics. One thing which stays is a good-over-evil win. Ahura Mazda made sure Spenta Mainyu wins against Angra Mainyu. People forget to be good and are stuck up in religious tenets. You say that there is Angra Mainyu or spiritual ignorance in everyone’s head. So what is keeping athiests from commiting a crime? Spiritual ignorance? Or personal awareness?
There is no need to be so much involved in a religion that you forget how to be free, for free will is what makes you human.
You don’t need priests, dasturs, rabbi or mullahs to teach and preach religion. Nowadays, majority of them do no good of anyone but blindfold them into a retarted progress. You need scholors and level headed people who understand religion and spread the knowledge and message rather than the dogmatic tenets.
You say progeny is not helping you preserve the religion and increase the numbers. Don’t you think if you, for once, stop being such a stuck up believer in a patriarchal socity/religion and stop cutting off ties with the women married outside and their children, maybe you’d not have so much problem doing the math. Marriage doesn’t convert somebody’s religion. A Parsee, who visits a temple/mosque/church, remains a parsee. Half of the community has faith in Sai Baba and Ganesha. Now does that interfere in your version of one god or all gods are one? Plus the way ties with women are conviniently cut off, shows how retarted and backward community thinking is. Patriarchal society. That’s what we are calling ourselves. How do you justify this? Ahura Mazda being male and fire being a masculine entity? I think you can do better than this.
The problem is not just being a patriarchal socity; its, cluttering your head so much with unwanted rules, stipulations and imaginary authority that it’s frustrating. We are such a sad bunch of people who can’t tolerate someone being happy. If one wants to go for an interfaith communion, everyone has a problem, though they don’t know any of the associated persons and frankly, will not do anything to help them individually if ever required.
Is this, what your way of religion is teaching? Then I’d rather follow a less muddy religious path where there’s no hate and only acceptance of love and the just. I’d rather be an atheist or an apatheist because it, at least, gives me a chance to decide right and wrong for myself and doesn’t force me to do thing against my will.
The Ganthas from Zend Avesta, teach the followers to worship only One God, understand righteousness and cosmic order, promote social justice and make a wise choice between good and evil. How come we don’t practise this but practise the parts of Avestas which deal with laws of ritual and practice with the traditions of the faith. These were written after Zoroaster (some argue many centuries later).
Conversion is not allowed as a repurcussion of Islamic invasion of Iran. The early followers chose to follow and they were accepted. A god is not a god if it rejects someone’s faith. If a hindu wants to have faith in Ahura Mazda, its not given the slightest support by the community. Failed here to acknowledge that when Iran exiled, India accomodated. Such hypocrites. This actually validates the notion that God is man made because God is a racist and so is man.
Its easy to find faults with everything; harder to do the right thing which needs to be done.
I have had the misfortune to attend a few so called Parsi religious functions in UK US HK and found 90% of the females gathered there without the Sudreh and Kusti in trying to be progressively fashionable. Does the author seriously think this is true Parsipanu????? No I am not MCP but just that the males were fully clothed. Is he really serious when he says they are happier because of it????. If this were so why have such Parsis, after so many years of trying, still struggling to establish a working Agiary. Pls note I am not talking of a Darbe-Meher where the fire is lit when someone finds time to offer a prayer but a 24 x 7 working Agiary bustling with daily rituals and activities.
I have had the misfortune to attend a few so called Parsi religious functions in UK US HK and found 90% of the females gathered there without the Sudreh and Kusti in trying to be progressively fashionable. Does the author seriously think this is true Parsipanu????? No I am not MCP but just that the males were fully clothed. Is he really serious when he says they are happier because of it????. If this were so why have such Parsis, after so many years of trying, still struggling to establish a working Agiary. Pls note I am not talking of a Darbe-Meher where the fire is lit when someone finds time to offer a prayer but a 24 x 7 working Agiary bustling with daily rituals and activities.
I KNOW OF MANY A PARSEE FAMILIES- BOTH HUBBY & WIFE BEING PARSEE ZOROASTRIANS SETTLED IN THE WEST BUT RELIGIOUS MINDED TO THE CORE. THEY GET THEIR SUDRAS AND KUSTIS FROM IN INDIA. THEREFORE IT IS HIGHLY PRESUMPTIVE AND BORDERS ON ARROGANCE TO INSINUATE THAT JUST BECAUSE THERE IS ABSENCE OF CONSECRATED FIRE TEMPLE IN THE WEST, THE CONCERNED PARSEES HAVE LOST THEIR “PARSIPANU’ TO ME THE IMPRESSION IS THAT PERSONS HOWLING FROM THE ROOFTOPS THAT THEY ARE TRADITIONAL AND ORTHODOX ASSUME THAT THEY ARE TORCH BEARERS OF THE FAITH. PERHAPS TO SUCH INDIVIDUALS A PARSEE FROM INDIA MARRIED TO A PERSON FROM ANOTHER FAITH IS A BETTER INDIVIDUAL THAN A PARSEE MARRIED WITHIN FOLD BUT RESIDING ABROAD. RELIGIOUS PRINCIPLES O OUR FAITH ARE TO BE PRACTICED IN REAL DAY TO DAY LIFE AND ARE NOT CONFINED TO JUST RECITING PRAYERS IN A FIRE TEMPLE.
I KNOW OF MANY A PARSEE FAMILIES- BOTH HUBBY & WIFE BEING PARSEE ZOROASTRIANS SETTLED IN THE WEST BUT RELIGIOUS MINDED TO THE CORE. THEY GET THEIR SUDRAS AND KUSTIS FROM IN INDIA. THEREFORE IT IS HIGHLY PRESUMPTIVE AND BORDERS ON ARROGANCE TO INSINUATE THAT JUST BECAUSE THERE IS ABSENCE OF CONSECRATED FIRE TEMPLE IN THE WEST, THE CONCERNED PARSEES HAVE LOST THEIR “PARSIPANU’ TO ME THE IMPRESSION IS THAT PERSONS HOWLING FROM THE ROOFTOPS THAT THEY ARE TRADITIONAL AND ORTHODOX ASSUME THAT THEY ARE TORCH BEARERS OF THE FAITH. PERHAPS TO SUCH INDIVIDUALS A PARSEE FROM INDIA MARRIED TO A PERSON FROM ANOTHER FAITH IS A BETTER INDIVIDUAL THAN A PARSEE MARRIED WITHIN FOLD BUT RESIDING ABROAD. RELIGIOUS PRINCIPLES O OUR FAITH ARE TO BE PRACTICED IN REAL DAY TO DAY LIFE AND ARE NOT CONFINED TO JUST RECITING PRAYERS IN A FIRE TEMPLE.
I KNOW OF MANY A PARSEE FAMILIES- BOTH HUBBY & WIFE BEING PARSEE ZOROASTRIANS SETTLED IN THE WEST BUT RELIGIOUS MINDED TO THE CORE. THEY GET THEIR SUDRAS AND KUSTIS FROM IN INDIA. THEREFORE IT IS HIGHLY PRESUMPTIVE AND BORDERS ON ARROGANCE TO INSINUATE THAT JUST BECAUSE THERE IS ABSENCE OF CONSECRATED FIRE TEMPLE IN THE WEST, THE CONCERNED PARSEES HAVE LOST THEIR “PARSIPANU’ TO ME THE IMPRESSION IS THAT PERSONS HOWLING FROM THE ROOFTOPS THAT THEY ARE TRADITIONAL AND ORTHODOX ASSUME THAT THEY ARE TORCH BEARERS OF THE FAITH. PERHAPS TO SUCH INDIVIDUALS A PARSEE FROM INDIA MARRIED TO A PERSON FROM ANOTHER FAITH IS A BETTER INDIVIDUAL THAN A PARSEE MARRIED WITHIN FOLD BUT RESIDING ABROAD. RELIGIOUS PRINCIPLES O OUR FAITH ARE TO BE PRACTICED IN REAL DAY TO DAY LIFE AND ARE NOT CONFINED TO JUST RECITING PRAYERS IN A FIRE TEMPLE.
It looks like Parsees settled abroad are more UNITED amongst themselves than we in mumbai.
It looks like Parsees settled abroad are more UNITED amongst themselves than we in mumbai.
Thank you Ms. Pervin Mistry . I wish to convey my deepest appreciation of your very apt and no nonsense reply. Nozer
Thank you Ms. Pervin Mistry . I wish to convey my deepest appreciation of your very apt and no nonsense reply. Nozer
The way I see it, a religion which doesn’t let you think freely is more of a confinement unit than a way of living. If people are true believers just by wearing the mandated sudreh-kusti and reciting a bunch of prayers, then I guess faith is just a placebo for having a God. Its not faith that keeps you going astray, its fear. Fear of God and fear of falling off the plank.
If religion can’t teach you to be moral and just because of the nature of it, then its not doing the job right. You tell me who is better, a god fearing person, with faith, refraining from crimes as it will lead to falling of a razor sharp Chinvat or a follower who chooses convinience and practicality and refuses to commit a crime just because its not right?
Every version of religion has its followers and fanatics. One thing which stays is a good-over-evil win. Ahura Mazda made sure Spenta Mainyu wins against Angra Mainyu. People forget to be good and are stuck up in religious tenets. You say that there is Angra Mainyu or spiritual ignorance in everyone’s head. So what is keeping athiests from commiting a crime? Spiritual ignorance? Or personal awareness?
There is no need to be so much involved in a religion that you forget how to be free, for free will is what makes you human.
You don’t need priests, dasturs, rabbi or mullahs to teach and preach religion. Nowadays, majority of them do no good of anyone but blindfold them into a retarted progress. You need scholors and level headed people who understand religion and spread the knowledge and message rather than the dogmatic tenets.
You say progeny is not helping you preserve the religion and increase the numbers. Don’t you think if you, for once, stop being such a stuck up believer in a patriarchal socity/religion and stop cutting off ties with the women married outside and their children, maybe you’d not have so much problem doing the math. Marriage doesn’t convert somebody’s religion. A Parsee, who visits a temple/mosque/church, remains a parsee. Half of the community has faith in Sai Baba and Ganesha. Now does that interfere in your version of one god or all gods are one? Plus the way ties with women are conviniently cut off, shows how retarted and backward community thinking is. Patriarchal society. That’s what we are calling ourselves. How do you justify this? Ahura Mazda being male and fire being a masculine entity? I think you can do better than this.
The problem is not just being a patriarchal socity; its, cluttering your head so much with unwanted rules, stipulations and imaginary authority that it’s frustrating. We are such a sad bunch of people who can’t tolerate someone being happy. If one wants to go for an interfaith communion, everyone has a problem, though they don’t know any of the associated persons and frankly, will not do anything to help them individually if ever required.
Is this, what your way of religion is teaching? Then I’d rather follow a less muddy religious path where there’s no hate and only acceptance of love and the just. I’d rather be an atheist or an apatheist because it, at least, gives me a chance to decide right and wrong for myself and doesn’t force me to do thing against my will.
The Ganthas from Zend Avesta, teach the followers to worship only One God, understand righteousness and cosmic order, promote social justice and make a wise choice between good and evil. How come we don’t practise this but practise the parts of Avestas which deal with laws of ritual and practice with the traditions of the faith. These were written after Zoroaster (some argue many centuries later).
Conversion is not allowed as a repurcussion of Islamic invasion of Iran. The early followers chose to follow and they were accepted. A god is not a god if it rejects someone’s faith. If a hindu wants to have faith in Ahura Mazda, its not given the slightest support by the community. Failed here to acknowledge that when Iran exiled, India accomodated. Such hypocrites. This actually validates the notion that God is man made because God is a racist and so is man.
Its easy to find faults with everything; harder to do the right thing which needs to be done.
The way I see it, a religion which doesn’t let you think freely is more of a confinement unit than a way of living. If people are true believers just by wearing the mandated sudreh-kusti and reciting a bunch of prayers, then I guess faith is just a placebo for having a God. Its not faith that keeps you going astray, its fear. Fear of God and fear of falling off the plank.
If religion can’t teach you to be moral and just because of the nature of it, then its not doing the job right. You tell me who is better, a god fearing person, with faith, refraining from crimes as it will lead to falling of a razor sharp Chinvat or a follower who chooses convinience and practicality and refuses to commit a crime just because its not right?
Every version of religion has its followers and fanatics. One thing which stays is a good-over-evil win. Ahura Mazda made sure Spenta Mainyu wins against Angra Mainyu. People forget to be good and are stuck up in religious tenets. You say that there is Angra Mainyu or spiritual ignorance in everyone’s head. So what is keeping athiests from commiting a crime? Spiritual ignorance? Or personal awareness?
There is no need to be so much involved in a religion that you forget how to be free, for free will is what makes you human.
You don’t need priests, dasturs, rabbi or mullahs to teach and preach religion. Nowadays, majority of them do no good of anyone but blindfold them into a retarted progress. You need scholors and level headed people who understand religion and spread the knowledge and message rather than the dogmatic tenets.
You say progeny is not helping you preserve the religion and increase the numbers. Don’t you think if you, for once, stop being such a stuck up believer in a patriarchal socity/religion and stop cutting off ties with the women married outside and their children, maybe you’d not have so much problem doing the math. Marriage doesn’t convert somebody’s religion. A Parsee, who visits a temple/mosque/church, remains a parsee. Half of the community has faith in Sai Baba and Ganesha. Now does that interfere in your version of one god or all gods are one? Plus the way ties with women are conviniently cut off, shows how retarted and backward community thinking is. Patriarchal society. That’s what we are calling ourselves. How do you justify this? Ahura Mazda being male and fire being a masculine entity? I think you can do better than this.
The problem is not just being a patriarchal socity; its, cluttering your head so much with unwanted rules, stipulations and imaginary authority that it’s frustrating. We are such a sad bunch of people who can’t tolerate someone being happy. If one wants to go for an interfaith communion, everyone has a problem, though they don’t know any of the associated persons and frankly, will not do anything to help them individually if ever required.
Is this, what your way of religion is teaching? Then I’d rather follow a less muddy religious path where there’s no hate and only acceptance of love and the just. I’d rather be an atheist or an apatheist because it, at least, gives me a chance to decide right and wrong for myself and doesn’t force me to do thing against my will.
The Ganthas from Zend Avesta, teach the followers to worship only One God, understand righteousness and cosmic order, promote social justice and make a wise choice between good and evil. How come we don’t practise this but practise the parts of Avestas which deal with laws of ritual and practice with the traditions of the faith. These were written after Zoroaster (some argue many centuries later).
Conversion is not allowed as a repurcussion of Islamic invasion of Iran. The early followers chose to follow and they were accepted. A god is not a god if it rejects someone’s faith. If a hindu wants to have faith in Ahura Mazda, its not given the slightest support by the community. Failed here to acknowledge that when Iran exiled, India accomodated. Such hypocrites. This actually validates the notion that God is man made because God is a racist and so is man.
Its easy to find faults with everything; harder to do the right thing which needs to be done.
May I add one question to Pervin? I do not find any mention in the article of Berjis Desai that Parsees settled in the west are progressive by not wearing sudra kashti.What makes Pervin presume that Parsees in the countries other than India do not offer Avesta Prayers or do not put on Sudra/Kashti. . I have heard BPP Trustees indulging in big talk about being Orthodox and Traditional minded standing with their spouses and daughters in skimpy spaghetti dress/blouse, (without Sudra). That is rank hypocrisy. If some person wants to deliver sermons just to read his or her name that is fine but that does not make such an individual more profoundly religious or traditional.So let us stop being sanctimonious and concede that Mumbai Parsees are a cranky lot.
May I add one question to Pervin? I do not find any mention in the article of Berjis Desai that Parsees settled in the west are progressive by not wearing sudra kashti.What makes Pervin presume that Parsees in the countries other than India do not offer Avesta Prayers or do not put on Sudra/Kashti. . I have heard BPP Trustees indulging in big talk about being Orthodox and Traditional minded standing with their spouses and daughters in skimpy spaghetti dress/blouse, (without Sudra). That is rank hypocrisy. If some person wants to deliver sermons just to read his or her name that is fine but that does not make such an individual more profoundly religious or traditional.So let us stop being sanctimonious and concede that Mumbai Parsees are a cranky lot.
May I add one question to Pervin? I do not find any mention in the article of Berjis Desai that Parsees settled in the west are progressive by not wearing sudra kashti.What makes Pervin presume that Parsees in the countries other than India do not offer Avesta Prayers or do not put on Sudra/Kashti. . I have heard BPP Trustees indulging in big talk about being Orthodox and Traditional minded standing with their spouses and daughters in skimpy spaghetti dress/blouse, (without Sudra). That is rank hypocrisy. If some person wants to deliver sermons just to read his or her name that is fine but that does not make such an individual more profoundly religious or traditional.So let us stop being sanctimonious and concede that Mumbai Parsees are a cranky lot.
Looks can be misleading and deceptive Mr. xyz
Farzu does it matter who thinks what ?????????
The rejoinder of Pervin Mistry smacks of sanctimoniousness of being ‘superior’ to other Parsees residing on foreign soil. What could be the objective for contents of such a rejoinder is not understood but it seems to be fashion among certain section of Parsees in Mumbai especially to wear the hat of orthodoxy which has lost its shape because those who have worn it, have performed “Parjat’ Navjotes unabashedly for persons who had passed the age of initiation decades before their Navjote (farcical though) was performed by a Vada Priest. So before indulging in criticism of others such “Orthodox” need to introspect about the actions of their own coterie. Gone are the days when whimsical and capacious acts of elders were never questioned. The integrity of such self styled traditionalists has been seen through and through.
Looks can be misleading and deceptive Mr. xyz
Looks can be misleading and deceptive Mr. xyz
Farzu does it matter who thinks what ?????????
Farzu does it matter who thinks what ?????????
Very well said Mrs. Mistry. Our community needs fervent people like you who practise the religion with complete devotion. Religion shows us the Right Path and we are not authorised to alter its mandates and tenets. Religion should be the guiding principle in our daily life. People tend to forget the importance of Spirituality in this Materialistic World. We must practise our Religion of Birth with minimum unavoidable compromises.
The rejoinder of Pervin Mistry smacks of sanctimoniousness of being ‘superior’ to other Parsees residing on foreign soil. What could be the objective for contents of such a rejoinder is not understood but it seems to be fashion among certain section of Parsees in Mumbai especially to wear the hat of orthodoxy which has lost its shape because those who have worn it, have performed “Parjat’ Navjotes unabashedly for persons who had passed the age of initiation decades before their Navjote (farcical though) was performed by a Vada Priest. So before indulging in criticism of others such “Orthodox” need to introspect about the actions of their own coterie. Gone are the days when whimsical and capacious acts of elders were never questioned. The integrity of such self styled traditionalists has been seen through and through.
The rejoinder of Pervin Mistry smacks of sanctimoniousness of being ‘superior’ to other Parsees residing on foreign soil. What could be the objective for contents of such a rejoinder is not understood but it seems to be fashion among certain section of Parsees in Mumbai especially to wear the hat of orthodoxy which has lost its shape because those who have worn it, have performed “Parjat’ Navjotes unabashedly for persons who had passed the age of initiation decades before their Navjote (farcical though) was performed by a Vada Priest. So before indulging in criticism of others such “Orthodox” need to introspect about the actions of their own coterie. Gone are the days when whimsical and capacious acts of elders were never questioned. The integrity of such self styled traditionalists has been seen through and through.
The rejoinder of Pervin Mistry smacks of sanctimoniousness of being ‘superior’ to other Parsees residing on foreign soil. What could be the objective for contents of such a rejoinder is not understood but it seems to be fashion among certain section of Parsees in Mumbai especially to wear the hat of orthodoxy which has lost its shape because those who have worn it, have performed “Parjat’ Navjotes unabashedly for persons who had passed the age of initiation decades before their Navjote (farcical though) was performed by a Vada Priest. So before indulging in criticism of others such “Orthodox” need to introspect about the actions of their own coterie. Gone are the days when whimsical and capacious acts of elders were never questioned. The integrity of such self styled traditionalists has been seen through and through.
That’s …….well said Ms Mistry……..thank you.
Very well said Mrs. Mistry. Our community needs fervent people like you who practise the religion with complete devotion. Religion shows us the Right Path and we are not authorised to alter its mandates and tenets. Religion should be the guiding principle in our daily life. People tend to forget the importance of Spirituality in this Materialistic World. We must practise our Religion of Birth with minimum unavoidable compromises.
Very well said Mrs. Mistry. Our community needs fervent people like you who practise the religion with complete devotion. Religion shows us the Right Path and we are not authorised to alter its mandates and tenets. Religion should be the guiding principle in our daily life. People tend to forget the importance of Spirituality in this Materialistic World. We must practise our Religion of Birth with minimum unavoidable compromises.
That’s …….well said Ms Mistry……..thank you.
That’s …….well said Ms Mistry……..thank you.
Why do you say misfortune? You were extremely fortunate to witness their being “Parsis” atleast. But were they whispering and talking while the prayers were going on? If not then they were serious about the function and are more than parisis, they are zarathustrians .Were they coughing due to the smoke of the atash ( they usually talk about pollution in India though)? if not, then there may have not been a good atash and loban. Were the kids running here and there and did their mothers say ” Muvahvo masti naa karo, avo dadji karyay” if not then the kids have new grown maybe. did they pay ashodad with a greater show off by saying in english accent “Bav mayjaanoo banyuch tamay”. All these are parsi pana first… didya see?
Why do you say misfortune? You were extremely fortunate to witness their being “Parsis” atleast. But were they whispering and talking while the prayers were going on? If not then they were serious about the function and are more than parisis, they are zarathustrians .Were they coughing due to the smoke of the atash ( they usually talk about pollution in India though)? if not, then there may have not been a good atash and loban. Were the kids running here and there and did their mothers say ” Muvahvo masti naa karo, avo dadji karyay” if not then the kids have new grown maybe. did they pay ashodad with a greater show off by saying in english accent “Bav mayjaanoo banyuch tamay”. All these are parsi pana first… didya see?
Why do you say misfortune? You were extremely fortunate to witness their being “Parsis” atleast. But were they whispering and talking while the prayers were going on? If not then they were serious about the function and are more than parisis, they are zarathustrians .Were they coughing due to the smoke of the atash ( they usually talk about pollution in India though)? if not, then there may have not been a good atash and loban. Were the kids running here and there and did their mothers say ” Muvahvo masti naa karo, avo dadji karyay” if not then the kids have new grown maybe. did they pay ashodad with a greater show off by saying in english accent “Bav mayjaanoo banyuch tamay”. All these are parsi pana first… didya see?
“We, the traditionalists, follow the
well-trodden path of our ancestors and will not become history! ” No Madam, you will NOT become HISTORY but the entire Community in India will be chapter in ANTHROPOLOGY for future generations to study the cause of decimation..
“We, the traditionalists, follow the
well-trodden path of our ancestors and will not become history! ” No Madam, you will NOT become HISTORY but the entire Community in India will be chapter in ANTHROPOLOGY for future generations to study the cause of decimation..
“We, the traditionalists, follow the
well-trodden path of our ancestors and will not become history! ” No Madam, you will NOT become HISTORY but the entire Community in India will be chapter in ANTHROPOLOGY for future generations to study the cause of decimation..
If it doesn’t, then everything you said in your comment displaying your feeling of having a misfortune, doesn’t even amount to crap…!!
And whoever made you a judge of someone’s faith.
If Ahura Mazda has a problem with my lifestyle… let him tell me, not you….!!
Hi Parsi Khabar ! I’m from Iran. Please insert your program if maybe for translation Texts to Persian language. Tanks
If it doesn’t, then everything you said in your comment displaying your feeling of having a misfortune, doesn’t even amount to crap…!!
And whoever made you a judge of someone’s faith.
If Ahura Mazda has a problem with my lifestyle… let him tell me, not you….!!
If it doesn’t, then everything you said in your comment displaying your feeling of having a misfortune, doesn’t even amount to crap…!!
And whoever made you a judge of someone’s faith.
If Ahura Mazda has a problem with my lifestyle… let him tell me, not you….!!
Hi Parsi Khabar ! I’m from Iran. Please insert your program if maybe for translation Texts to Persian language. Tanks
Hi Parsi Khabar ! I’m from Iran. Please insert your program if maybe for translation Texts to Persian language. Tanks
@ Phiroze, You are very correct. Who cares for what you or I think and believe in but does that mean that you will stop being pontifical? Needless to add that Pervin Mistry’s reply has been dissected and torn to shreds by many.
Well said Pervin aunty.
While Parsis abroad have regular get togethers, jashans, etc its more about fun, food and socializing (which by itself is not bad), but there needs to be a concious effort to follow certain basic tarikats. I agree with Phiroze as I myself have attended a few community functions (jashans) in Aus and NZ. Most of the attendees do not even bother to do the Kushti before entering the prayer hall. I remember getting odd looks from the others when I did my Kushti there.
Something felt amiss.
Hi Pervin, in today’s world , it is fashionable to ridicule our time honoured traditions, i would like to thank you for your fantastic reply. It takes courage to speak up for the traditionalists.
Farzu, you are the one judging the “PARSIS” and their faith and it does not matter to them. If Ahura Mazda has a problem with the PARSIS faith ……let HIM/HER tell us, not you or Madon or Mirza or Moos or Desai or ARZ ….!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Farzu, you are the one judging the “PARSIS” and their faith and it does not matter to them. If Ahura Mazda has a problem with the PARSIS faith ……let HIM/HER tell us, not you or Madon or Mirza or Moos or Desai or ARZ ….!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Well said Pervin aunty.
While Parsis abroad have regular get togethers, jashans, etc its more about fun, food and socializing (which by itself is not bad), but there needs to be a concious effort to follow certain basic tarikats. I agree with Phiroze as I myself have attended a few community functions (jashans) in Aus and NZ. Most of the attendees do not even bother to do the Kushti before entering the prayer hall. I remember getting odd looks from the others when I did my Kushti there.
Something felt amiss.
Well said Pervin aunty.
While Parsis abroad have regular get togethers, jashans, etc its more about fun, food and socializing (which by itself is not bad), but there needs to be a concious effort to follow certain basic tarikats. I agree with Phiroze as I myself have attended a few community functions (jashans) in Aus and NZ. Most of the attendees do not even bother to do the Kushti before entering the prayer hall. I remember getting odd looks from the others when I did my Kushti there.
Something felt amiss.
It seems that more persons like the comments of Contradhongi, and S Madon than the comments of Pervin Mistry. Perhaps that can be attributed to letter’s inability to give a point wise reply to issues raised by these two persons in their comments.
@ Unwalla, I will if you stop. Equal if not more have appreciated Pervin Mistry’s reply. And where is Farzu???????
It seems that more persons like the comments of Contradhongi, and S Madon than the comments of Pervin Mistry. Perhaps that can be attributed to letter’s inability to give a point wise reply to issues raised by these two persons in their comments.
It seems that more persons like the comments of Contradhongi, and S Madon than the comments of Pervin Mistry. Perhaps that can be attributed to letter’s inability to give a point wise reply to issues raised by these two persons in their comments.
@ Unwalla, I will if you stop. Equal if not more have appreciated Pervin Mistry’s reply. And where is Farzu???????
@ Unwalla, I will if you stop. Equal if not more have appreciated Pervin Mistry’s reply. And where is Farzu???????
@ Unwalla, I will if you stop. Equal if not more have appreciated Pervin Mistry’s reply. And where is Farzu???????
Mr. Phiroze, Where have I asked you to stop being pontifical. All that I have done is to question you if you would desist from being pontifical knowing well that others ‘do not care of what you think’ or write about. (I am referring to your own message of 5 days back). I do not know who is Farzu you refer to. I am not keeping tabs on others nor do I know them personally for if I did know them, persons like you would have disappeared from pontificating. because we would have overwhelmed persons like you with well coordinated replies. Please do not assess others by your own standards.
Mr. Phiroze, Where have I asked you to stop being pontifical. All that I have done is to question you if you would desist from being pontifical knowing well that others ‘do not care of what you think’ or write about. (I am referring to your own message of 5 days back). I do not know who is Farzu you refer to. I am not keeping tabs on others nor do I know them personally for if I did know them, persons like you would have disappeared from pontificating. because we would have overwhelmed persons like you with well coordinated replies. Please do not assess others by your own standards.
Mr. Phiroze, Where have I asked you to stop being pontifical. All that I have done is to question you if you would desist from being pontifical knowing well that others ‘do not care of what you think’ or write about. (I am referring to your own message of 5 days back). I do not know who is Farzu you refer to. I am not keeping tabs on others nor do I know them personally for if I did know them, persons like you would have disappeared from pontificating. because we would have overwhelmed persons like you with well coordinated replies. Please do not assess others by your own standards.
And who cares for what Pervin Mistry or any other self appointed Traditionalists (actually rigid – unable to be flexible) thinks, believes or expresses. In any case , as Byram Sidhwa has rightly observed, there are more supporters holding opinion contrary to what Ms. Mistry has expresses as demonstrated by “LIKES”. Dont say that even such likes are manipulated.
And who cares for what Pervin Mistry or any other self appointed Traditionalists (actually rigid – unable to be flexible) thinks, believes or expresses. In any case , as Byram Sidhwa has rightly observed, there are more supporters holding opinion contrary to what Ms. Mistry has expresses as demonstrated by “LIKES”. Dont say that even such likes are manipulated.
And who cares for what Pervin Mistry or any other self appointed Traditionalists (actually rigid – unable to be flexible) thinks, believes or expresses. In any case , as Byram Sidhwa has rightly observed, there are more supporters holding opinion contrary to what Ms. Mistry has expresses as demonstrated by “LIKES”. Dont say that even such likes are manipulated.
Even if last 2 parsees are alive on this earth, they will be fighting in the courts.
Even if last 2 parsees are alive on this earth, they will be fighting in the courts.
Even if last 2 parsees are alive on this earth, they will be fighting in the courts.
Mr. Unwalla, since you replied to my question to Farzu it is assumed that you know her. As I said will stop if you stop. Bring on the well coordinated replies.
Dear Pervin Mistry aunty,
I am so lucky to have found a religious guide like you. I am sure many youngsters like me who have been misguided by their parents into believing that our religion is universal, and for all mankind have now been able to see through their lies. Please guide me to good authentic religious literature so that I can confront them whenever they try to twist facts about our religion. May God grant you a long and healthy life.
Mr. Unwalla, since you replied to my question to Farzu it is assumed that you know her. As I said will stop if you stop. Bring on the well coordinated replies.
Mr. Unwalla, since you replied to my question to Farzu it is assumed that you know her. As I said will stop if you stop. Bring on the well coordinated replies.
Mr. Unwalla, since you replied to my question to Farzu it is assumed that you know her. As I said will stop if you stop. Bring on the well coordinated replies.
Dear Pervin Mistry aunty,
I am so lucky to have found a religious guide like you. I am sure many youngsters like me who have been misguided by their parents into believing that our religion is universal, and for all mankind have now been able to see through their lies. Please guide me to good authentic religious literature so that I can confront them whenever they try to twist facts about our religion. May God grant you a long and healthy life.
Dear Pervin Mistry aunty,
I am so lucky to have found a religious guide like you. I am sure many youngsters like me who have been misguided by their parents into believing that our religion is universal, and for all mankind have now been able to see through their lies. Please guide me to good authentic religious literature so that I can confront them whenever they try to twist facts about our religion. May God grant you a long and healthy life.
Dear Pervin Mistry aunty,
I am so lucky to have found a religious guide like you. I am sure many youngsters like me who have been misguided by their parents into believing that our religion is universal, and for all mankind have now been able to see through their lies. Please guide me to good authentic religious literature so that I can confront them whenever they try to twist facts about our religion. May God grant you a long and healthy life.
Freek Magin….. Your last line…. It should be read ” GOD MADE MAN IN HIS OWN IMAGE”
Mr. Phiroze, This is an open forum and I was not aware that you want one to one conversation on this portal. Your imagination seems to run riot.I do not take instructions from nobody’s when to stop. In fact I do not wish you too should stop because if you do stop, then I will miss all the fun in getting you tied up knots, as you have been assuming that I act on behalf of others.
Freek Magin….. Your last line…. It should be read ” GOD MADE MAN IN HIS OWN IMAGE”
Freek Magin….. Your last line…. It should be read ” GOD MADE MAN IN HIS OWN IMAGE”
Mr. Phiroze, This is an open forum and I was not aware that you want one to one conversation on this portal. Your imagination seems to run riot.I do not take instructions from nobody’s when to stop. In fact I do not wish you too should stop because if you do stop, then I will miss all the fun in getting you tied up knots, as you have been assuming that I act on behalf of others.
Mr. Phiroze, This is an open forum and I was not aware that you want one to one conversation on this portal. Your imagination seems to run riot.I do not take instructions from nobody’s when to stop. In fact I do not wish you too should stop because if you do stop, then I will miss all the fun in getting you tied up knots, as you have been assuming that I act on behalf of others.
Our community in India is tiny in numbers but have many egoists craving to impose their ‘way’ of following the Religion. We should be Jarthostees first and last both. There is no scope for cults like Pandolism or Ilm Khushnoom. Thet only end up to fragment the community further.
Our community in India is tiny in numbers but have many egoists craving to impose their ‘way’ of following the Religion. We should be Jarthostees first and last both. There is no scope for cults like Pandolism or Ilm Khushnoom. Thet only end up to fragment the community further.
Our community in India is tiny in numbers but have many egoists craving to impose their ‘way’ of following the Religion. We should be Jarthostees first and last both. There is no scope for cults like Pandolism or Ilm Khushnoom. Thet only end up to fragment the community further.
I would like to ask a pointed question to Ms. Mistry. It is an indisputable fact that in many towns many a Fire Temples have closed down. What is the reason other than paucity of funds which is a direct consequence of declining population.No lady, I an not in support of inter faith alliances nor am I alluding to that touchy topic. But you seem to have something against Parsee Zoroastrians settled abroad. Why may I ask?. Not all are married to members of other religious denominations. Most of those settled in other Countries are prosperous and thriving. Why? Why many a Parsee youth are at a disadvantage. I do not think Religion has anything to do with settling abroad or on western part of India.
Can you deny that in Mumbai- Surat belts, Parsees are anything but united, cohesive, sensible and polite and why may I ask.
Priests are an integral part of any Religion. I fully concur but is it not specified that each Ervard has to undergo Burshnoom at specific periods before he can offer Boi. Does that happen in reality?. As per tenets an Ervard has to sport a Beard. How many Priests and that includes high Priest are clean shaven? Madam, the list is endless. Before being critical of each other , impart a virtue to UNITE rather than encouraging feuds.
I would like to ask a pointed question to Ms. Mistry. It is an indisputable fact that in many towns many a Fire Temples have closed down. What is the reason other than paucity of funds which is a direct consequence of declining population.No lady, I an not in support of inter faith alliances nor am I alluding to that touchy topic. But you seem to have something against Parsee Zoroastrians settled abroad. Why may I ask?. Not all are married to members of other religious denominations. Most of those settled in other Countries are prosperous and thriving. Why? Why many a Parsee youth are at a disadvantage. I do not think Religion has anything to do with settling abroad or on western part of India.
Can you deny that in Mumbai- Surat belts, Parsees are anything but united, cohesive, sensible and polite and why may I ask.
Priests are an integral part of any Religion. I fully concur but is it not specified that each Ervard has to undergo Burshnoom at specific periods before he can offer Boi. Does that happen in reality?. As per tenets an Ervard has to sport a Beard. How many Priests and that includes high Priest are clean shaven? Madam, the list is endless. Before being critical of each other , impart a virtue to UNITE rather than encouraging feuds.
I would like to ask a pointed question to Ms. Mistry. It is an indisputable fact that in many towns many a Fire Temples have closed down. What is the reason other than paucity of funds which is a direct consequence of declining population.No lady, I an not in support of inter faith alliances nor am I alluding to that touchy topic. But you seem to have something against Parsee Zoroastrians settled abroad. Why may I ask?. Not all are married to members of other religious denominations. Most of those settled in other Countries are prosperous and thriving. Why? Why many a Parsee youth are at a disadvantage. I do not think Religion has anything to do with settling abroad or on western part of India.
Can you deny that in Mumbai- Surat belts, Parsees are anything but united, cohesive, sensible and polite and why may I ask.
Priests are an integral part of any Religion. I fully concur but is it not specified that each Ervard has to undergo Burshnoom at specific periods before he can offer Boi. Does that happen in reality?. As per tenets an Ervard has to sport a Beard. How many Priests and that includes high Priest are clean shaven? Madam, the list is endless. Before being critical of each other , impart a virtue to UNITE rather than encouraging feuds.
Then be it.
I am not judging you. Nor am I judging the Parsis.
I have no issues with faiths and cultures and gods.
I have issues with being fanatic and rigid and imposing your beliefs and tenets on everyone. Just because one is born a Parsi doesn’t mean he/she is bound by the rules you have laid down (which can be totally inhuman and stupid). And whatever drives you to believe that I am not a Parsi.
And frankly, “If Ahura Mazda has a problem with the PARSIS faith ……let HIM/HER tell us, not you or Madon or Mirza or Moos or Desai or ARZ ….!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ” goes against your very belief of having one god. I guess it was one god for Parsis. This eventually validates the unintentional and unconscious conflict you are conspiring, with every other religion.
You can’t control me from following a faith or a god. If I call Ahura Mazda for my happiness and sorrows, and you tell me that he’s not my god, then you are the one who’s judging. You are imposing your beliefs on me. And as you said, it doesn’t matter.
If you are so stoic to my comments, then you have all the ways to refrain from the argument/discussion. Looking at your comments, it seems that you are the one who’s most disturbed.
If “GOD MADE MAN IN HIS OWN IMAGE”, then I refuse to believe in god.
We are a sorry lot. If we are god’s image, then I hope he doesn’t exist.
To begin With, I am not ‘Farzu’. Your assumptions are your problem. If you’d stop assuming everything and quantify things for yourself, maybe then you’ll understand the other side of the coin.
But that’s doubtful.
Then be it.
I am not judging you. Nor am I judging the Parsis.
I have no issues with faiths and cultures and gods.
I have issues with being fanatic and rigid and imposing your beliefs and tenets on everyone. Just because one is born a Parsi doesn’t mean he/she is bound by the rules you have laid down (which can be totally inhuman and stupid). And whatever drives you to believe that I am not a Parsi.
And frankly, “If Ahura Mazda has a problem with the PARSIS faith ……let HIM/HER tell us, not you or Madon or Mirza or Moos or Desai or ARZ ….!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ” goes against your very belief of having one god. I guess it was one god for Parsis. This eventually validates the unintentional and unconscious conflict you are conspiring, with every other religion.
You can’t control me from following a faith or a god. If I call Ahura Mazda for my happiness and sorrows, and you tell me that he’s not my god, then you are the one who’s judging. You are imposing your beliefs on me. And as you said, it doesn’t matter.
If you are so stoic to my comments, then you have all the ways to refrain from the argument/discussion. Looking at your comments, it seems that you are the one who’s most disturbed.
Then be it.
I am not judging you. Nor am I judging the Parsis.
I have no issues with faiths and cultures and gods.
I have issues with being fanatic and rigid and imposing your beliefs and tenets on everyone. Just because one is born a Parsi doesn’t mean he/she is bound by the rules you have laid down (which can be totally inhuman and stupid). And whatever drives you to believe that I am not a Parsi.
And frankly, “If Ahura Mazda has a problem with the PARSIS faith ……let HIM/HER tell us, not you or Madon or Mirza or Moos or Desai or ARZ ….!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ” goes against your very belief of having one god. I guess it was one god for Parsis. This eventually validates the unintentional and unconscious conflict you are conspiring, with every other religion.
You can’t control me from following a faith or a god. If I call Ahura Mazda for my happiness and sorrows, and you tell me that he’s not my god, then you are the one who’s judging. You are imposing your beliefs on me. And as you said, it doesn’t matter.
If you are so stoic to my comments, then you have all the ways to refrain from the argument/discussion. Looking at your comments, it seems that you are the one who’s most disturbed.
Then be it.
I am not judging you. Nor am I judging the Parsis.
I have no issues with faiths and cultures and gods.
I have issues with being fanatic and rigid and imposing your beliefs and tenets on everyone. Just because one is born a Parsi doesn’t mean he/she is bound by the rules you have laid down (which can be totally inhuman and stupid). And whatever drives you to believe that I am not a Parsi.
And frankly, “If Ahura Mazda has a problem with the PARSIS faith ……let HIM/HER tell us, not you or Madon or Mirza or Moos or Desai or ARZ ….!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ” goes against your very belief of having one god. I guess it was one god for Parsis. This eventually validates the unintentional and unconscious conflict you are conspiring, with every other religion.
You can’t control me from following a faith or a god. If I call Ahura Mazda for my happiness and sorrows, and you tell me that he’s not my god, then you are the one who’s judging. You are imposing your beliefs on me. And as you said, it doesn’t matter.
If you are so stoic to my comments, then you have all the ways to refrain from the argument/discussion. Looking at your comments, it seems that you are the one who’s most disturbed.
If “GOD MADE MAN IN HIS OWN IMAGE”, then I refuse to believe in god.
We are a sorry lot. If we are god’s image, then I hope he doesn’t exist.
If “GOD MADE MAN IN HIS OWN IMAGE”, then I refuse to believe in god.
We are a sorry lot. If we are god’s image, then I hope he doesn’t exist.
To begin With, I am not ‘Farzu’. Your assumptions are your problem. If you’d stop assuming everything and quantify things for yourself, maybe then you’ll understand the other side of the coin.
But that’s doubtful.
To begin With, I am not ‘Farzu’. Your assumptions are your problem. If you’d stop assuming everything and quantify things for yourself, maybe then you’ll understand the other side of the coin.
But that’s doubtful.
Mr. PhirozeWhat is the difference between the acts of omission and commission of Madan & Mirza and those Priests who performed Wadia Navjotes and Uthamna of JRD? BTW, How many persons have expressed LIKES for what Ms Pervin has uttered? Perhaps the 20 Likes are due to kind courtesy of persons like you who pressed LIKE every day.
Mr. PhirozeWhat is the difference between the acts of omission and
commission of Madan & Mirza and those Priests who performed Wadia
Navjotes and Uthamna of JRD? BTW, How many persons have expressed LIKES
for what Ms Pervin has uttered? Perhaps the 20 Likes are due to kind
courtesy of persons like you who pressed LIKE every day.
Dear Magin Feek,
The point here is who exactly is a Convertist. Is it a Parsee Zoroastrian scrupulously adhering to the teachings of the Prophet or fake preacher who wants the gullible to believe that things will improve after the arrival of of a Saheb. According to many actual convertists are a motley group of persons who want all religious minded to subscribe to their agenda about arrival of a Soshyont.The person who ‘foretold’ this a century back said that the year of arrival of this Saheb would be 2002. .Now self styled Scholars are still imposing this prediction though we are in 2012. When questioned about the year of arrival of this Saheb, the same dozen individuals posing themselves as ‘enlightened’ resort to name calling and even reporting such questions as ‘Objectionable / Offensive’and getting them deleted on Social Networking sites. They do not realize that rational and educated Parsees are not going to get frustrated and will reply through E Mails as many of us have over 800 E Mail addresses of Parsee Zoroastrians all over the world who scoff at such cultists.Such individuals need to realize that not all are myopic and there are many ways to express dissent besides the print media and Face Book. Earlier wisdom dawns o. them, better for their salvation.
Dear Danesh, No body will ever give you reply on a open forum because these saintly elements have had to chew their own past prognostications. Having burnt their fingers, at best they will ask you to meet them in person and then show their ‘class’. Mark my words.
Dear Danesh, No body will ever give you reply on a open forum because these saintly elements have had to chew their own past prognostications. Having burnt their fingers, at best they will ask you to meet them in person and then show their ‘class’. Mark my words.
Dear Danesh, No body will ever give you reply on a open forum because these saintly elements have had to chew their own past prognostications. Having burnt their fingers, at best they will ask you to meet them in person and then show their ‘class’. Mark my words.
Conversion/convertist is a concept that we have come up with. Its just an opinion change. Something similar to discovering something new.
When people discovered that the Earth is not the center of the universe, perseptions changed.
The problem is not who’s trying to convert whom, but it’s who’s resisting logic and truth. When 800+ e mails flow around, how come there are only a few voices heard. Is it that people know but don’t bother?
We behave like cattle. We love to follow. What we need is the right path. The right path is of logic and reason. Either live your own opinion or keep looking for acceptance, inturn, losing your identity and yourself.
I refuse to live on someone else’s beliefs. Even if that means being ostracized from the society. I refuse to be guided or forced on some bigoted path, for I am not a brainless sheep.
I have brain and a thought process and I have questions. If I do not get a logical answer, I reject the ideas. I don’t care for the self appointed prophecy makers. I have one life and I have to make it matter. Can’t let some prophecy affect me. The entire idea seems unerasonable.
Conversion/convertist is a concept that we have come up with. Its just an opinion change. Something similar to discovering something new.
When people discovered that the Earth is not the center of the universe, perseptions changed.
The problem is not who’s trying to convert whom, but it’s who’s resisting logic and truth. When 800+ e mails flow around, how come there are only a few voices heard. Is it that people know but don’t bother?
We behave like cattle. We love to follow. What we need is the right path. The right path is of logic and reason. Either live your own opinion or keep looking for acceptance, inturn, losing your identity and yourself.
I refuse to live on someone else’s beliefs. Even if that means being ostracized from the society. I refuse to be guided or forced on some bigoted path, for I am not a brainless sheep.
I have brain and a thought process and I have questions. If I do not get a logical answer, I reject the ideas. I don’t care for the self appointed prophecy makers. I have one life and I have to make it matter. Can’t let some prophecy affect me. The entire idea seems unerasonable.
Conversion/convertist is a concept that we have come up with. Its just an opinion change. Something similar to discovering something new.
When people discovered that the Earth is not the center of the universe, perseptions changed.
The problem is not who’s trying to convert whom, but it’s who’s resisting logic and truth. When 800+ e mails flow around, how come there are only a few voices heard. Is it that people know but don’t bother?
We behave like cattle. We love to follow. What we need is the right path. The right path is of logic and reason. Either live your own opinion or keep looking for acceptance, inturn, losing your identity and yourself.
I refuse to live on someone else’s beliefs. Even if that means being ostracized from the society. I refuse to be guided or forced on some bigoted path, for I am not a brainless sheep.
I have brain and a thought process and I have questions. If I do not get a logical answer, I reject the ideas. I don’t care for the self appointed prophecy makers. I have one life and I have to make it matter. Can’t let some prophecy affect me. The entire idea seems unerasonable.
Replace abroad with outside Mumbai, u get the same result, u dont have to look far and wide
CONGRATULATIONS our Humdins Abroad.as the sayig goes: “PRAY To-gather, EAT To-gather, WORK n PLAY To-gather, as many times as possible. KEEPS US To-gather.”
I have observed over a period various nationalities converging to Pune in large numbers basically for education and work experience, etc. among all these various nationalities the Palestanians stood out far above everyone especially in trouble. Even if one of them would get into trouble, within NO time anything from 20-40 2-whlrs. with 2-3 on a bike would land up to help. Fantastic unity.
Hope our Hamdins do and act similarly to help out one in need.
GOD BLESS YOU ALL!!!