HC upholds liberal view in Parsi community

The trustees of the Bombay Parsi Panchayat (BPP) cannot arrogate powers to themselves in a mistaken belief that they are custodians of religion, the Bombay High Court today ruled while lifting a ban imposed by the Panchayat on two Parsi Zoroastrian priests barring them from performing religious rites and ceremonies.

In a face-off between the orthodox and liberal Parsi Zoroastrians, former municipal commissioner Jamsheed Kanga and Homi Khushrokhan had contested the ban imposed by BPP under the Deed of Trust of 1884 on priests Framroze Mirza and Khushroo Madon in June 2009 for performing “ceremonies that did not have sanction of the religion.”

"The court has carefully gone through the Deed of Trust and we do not find any provision that empowers the trustees to prevent a duly ordained Zoroastrian priest from performing religious rites and ceremonies in the Tower of Silence and Agiaries as far as it is for Parsi members," a division bench of Justices D Y Chandrachud and A V Mohta have observed.

Originally published in the Indian Express

  • Zarathustra Zarthosti

    Dadar Ahura Mazda ni aehvij madat hojoji

    KHSHNAOTHRE AHURAHE MAZDAO

  • Farsak. Ashli.

    ARE THESE TRUSTEES NOT ANSWERABLE TO THE COMMUNITY WHICH ELECTED THEM TO OFFICE FOR WASTING FINANCIAL RESOURCES IN AVOIDABLE LITIGATION AND CAUSING MONETARY LOSS TO A CHARITABLE TRUST?

  • kerssie wadia

    Hope the BPP will now realize that we do not live in a banana republic. The law of the land has prevailed. The Constitution of India is supreme.

  • AHURA MAZDA NEVER FAILS.

  • BOMAN.

    Folks,
    Recollect this message supposedly addressed to me?
    ===============================================
    . “Phiroze 7 March 2011 at 3:54 pm #
    boman,
    And not a day shall pass without me posting against all anti parsis without a thought to its repercurssions.
    rathestar dalal farzana barak zz are all part of the same anti parsi matrix”
    ============================================
    TO DAY IS THE DAY ALL PAPER TIGERS CLAIMING TO BE HOLIER THAN OTHERS AND PASSING THEMSELVES AS RELIGIOUS SCHOLARS & PROUD “ORTHODOX” HAVE SUDDENLY FOUND THEIR PENS WITH INK THEREIN DRIED UP.
    TO DAY IS THE DAY WHEN SUCH FAKE SCHOLARS HAVE FOUND NO TIME POST THEIR PEDANTIC VIEWS ON THIS PORTAL.

  • ICCHAPORIA.

    There is a talk of going in for an Appeal against the Order of the High Court. Is the Trust money to be thrown down the drain by paying fees of Counsels and Legal Advisors? I agree with F Asli. Who will be answerable if the Appeal too fails?

  • Z.D.

    Charity Trusts were set up by earlier generations to take care of the needs of the downtrodden in the field of education, health care, old age and for protecting the estates from encroachments and NOT for throwing disposable funds in paying Lawyers in fruitless court cases. Did these Trustees not obtain a Legal opinion before passing a Resolution banning the two Ervads? Some sort of accountability of the Trustees is a must otherwise the Trust coffers will become empty sooner than expected.

  • Rathestar.

    It has to be remembered that every Parsi in Mumbai is a deemed beneficiary of B.P.P. and from this follows the right to question the wisdom, judgment and appropriateness of the Trustees on their acts of omission and commission that ended in a fiasco of their ill conceived Resolution beyond the scope of the powers vested in them by the framework of the relative Trust deed. In short it is an act of transgressing their authority and knowingly acting in a manner otherwise than in their best judgment. They owe it to the community to make good the drain of Trust money on a Court case, cause of action of which was of their making.

  • Rustom Havewalla

    I wish the things had not gone that far. This kind of infighting creates a very bad impression of the community on the people of this country and also of the world.

    Banning the priests on some disciplinary grounds is the authority of the Sect or Association of Persons to which the Priests are affiliated. Maybe, the High Priests, could do have done so. But, then again, they could have done so only within the boundaries of their territories.

    What is unfortunate is that these BANNED priests are used and misused by vested interest to serve their own selfish purposes.

    Another more unfortunate thing is that since these Banned Priests are not as intellectual or learned as our Vada Dasturjis, they usually, inadvertently, pass on the wrong information and description about our religion and religious ceremonies, while giving SPEECHES after performing A Parsi Wedding Ceremony of A Parsi with a Non-Parsi. I wish they at least stop giving their speeches on religion as their knowledge on religious matters is extremely limited.

    It is also unfortunate that people with more money and time at their disposal are misusing them in litigations instead of doing charity or working for the poor, the hungry and the sick.

    Using adjectives, calling names and provoking others are the acts that are normally done by children. I don’t think that Adults should indulge in such childish pranks.

  • Rukhshana

    Well said Rustom Havewala. I was not aware that these renegades also give speeches ! It would be a great entertainment for all of us if someone could record their speeches and post it on You tube for all of us to have a good laugh.

    Even nature did not approve of the unjust verdict given at the Bombay H.C. yesterday. As soon as the verdict was announced there was a Tsunami attack in Japan and a loud explosion at Fukushima nuke plant where nature’s fury was there for everyone to see. The two learned judges will now realise what a grave mistake they have made in their judgement and reverse the verdict before it is too late.

    Despite this verdict no one at Doongerwadi would like to touch these two priests with a barge pole now that their names have been blacklisted by the BPP.It is a very sad day for the ENTIRE Parsi community.

  • Kanga.

    I agree with the contents of first para of Rustom Havewalla’s message. The community has generated needless and avoidable adverse publicity.But I totally disagree with para 3 of his message.In what way the so called High/ Scholar priests been different. They too did Navjotes selectively according to expediancy. Less said the better.
    Rustom overlooks that this type of legal cases are caused by “Tharavs” (Resolutions)passed by those who are occupying the Chairs of Trusteeship without application of mind about the ramifications.It is is for B.P.P. to confine itself to management of charity work.
    As to Rustom’s remark about the wealthy spending time and money on Court cases, my question is could an ordinary Parsi with limited means have secured justice against a Trustee created problem ?
    Flexibility and accommodating each other is the need of the hour considering our numbers.Both sides should sit across the table and sort out many thorny issues without rigidity and self importance at the thought of ‘Majority’

  • Kanga.

    Forgot to add that I fully concur with contents of last para of what Rustom has opined but feel that it is applicable more to yellow pages of fortnightly FPJ pages under the banner “Humor” which adds to already nauseating contents of the main page.Sorry Rustom for speaking my mind out.

  • Siloo Kapadia

    Finally. Common sense prevails! Hopefully it will not be too late or else the community in India is doomed.

  • khoremand

    Rukhshana, you mean, in retaliation to verdict of Bombay HC, God brought tsunami in Japan !!! Are you ok? Are your parents siblings?
    I dunno about the speeches that priests gives but you certainly are hilarious

  • Ratan Unwalla

    GREAT VICTORY. GOD IS GREAT.

    PARSI PUNCHAYET BAN ON PRIESTS QUASHED.
    The Trust Has No Powers to Impose It: High Court.

    Also read on: http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/mumbai/Parsi-Punchayet-ban-on-priests-quashed/articleshow/7683239.cms

    The Bombay High Court on Friday quashed a ban on two priests imposed by the Bombay Parsi Punchayet (BPP). The High Court held that the Trust did not have powers to ban any ordained Parsi Zoroastrian priest from performing religious rites and ceremonies at the Towers of Silence and agiaries (fire temples). Allowing such wide rights (of excluding priests) would result in “a grave affront to basic human rights and dignity”.

  • Rathestar.

    Moderator,
    Sir,
    In what way the tragedy in Japan has to do with the judgment delivered by the Court as is being suggested by one Rukshana hereinabove. Has trivalisation any place in serious, rational .debate, I wonder.Even a K.G. class kid will not agree to such a drivel. By allowing airing of such ‘profound’ thinking, if it can be at all called thinking, you are allowing the portal to encourage irrational conduct.
    . After reading this message from Rukshana,I switched on T.V. to watch Cyrus Broacha’s Weekly Show “The Week that wasn’t”. That show is at least a genuine attempt of spoofing unlike Rukshana’s mind boggling ‘thoughts’.
    Apologies in advance for expressing my feelings.

  • Rathestar…

    I agree with you.

    Comments published here are the author’s own thoughts. In no way do they convey the position of Parsi Khabar on that particular topic.

  • DSV

    “The court has carefully gone through the Deed of Trust and we do not find any provision that empowers the trustees to prevent a duly ordained Zoroastrian priest from performing religious rites and ceremonies in the Tower of Silence and Agiaries as far as it is for Parsi members,”

    that’s correct but than in 1884 , the settlers did not know that after 125 years parsis will have a different frame of mind, will not stand united , there wiill be constant mudslinging , bringing each other down over trivial matters , neither do they knew that there will be preists who will question the wisdom of our forefathers , will question the norms laid by our forefathers to safeguard the community and maintain its “distinctivness” . the purpose of not allowing conversions , is not been based on any religious scriptures and that was very well known by our wise forefathers, but i humbly feel and stress it is for the purpose of maintaining our “DISTINCTIVE IDENTITY” (physical and mental) , that this pratha may have become prevalant , and so what’s wrong if we do want continue that “pratha” to maintain our “DISTINCTIVE IDENTITy”.

  • Byram. Sidhwa.

    Good one Khoremand. I am aware of preponderance of senile dementia within our community but never realized that it existed even among middle aged persons at this level of intensity that they utter incoherent nonsense. Perhaps that is how their elders taught them to keep others subjugated. B.P.P. must open up subsidized psychiatric centres for benefit of such persons suffering from hallucinations.

  • PHIROZ.

    Havewalla has spoken a correct advise to all to desist from uttering adjectives against otheres whose line of thinking is different. Both sides ought to exercise maturity. In fact, I read in to day’s Mumbai Samachar a long winding diatribe from a person who had boasted at Sanjan that he was running a
    Rs. 500 crore empire. Was this letter that has appeared in Mumbai Samachar to -day not a provocation to retaliate.? Level headed and sensible persons should direct this sage advise to this ‘great’ industrialist who himself lives in a house of glass yet throws stones at others.

  • Rukhshana,

    Your statement that this epoch making verdict of the Honorable High Court of Mumbai, has triggered the Earthquake and Tsunami in Japan is laughable to say the least.

    May Ahura Mazda bless you with some rational thinking and wisdom.

  • A GREAT VICTORY…
    A HISTORIC VERDICT….

    Our sincere gratitude to the legal team for putting up the case so well.

    Our side was represented by Senior Advocate I. M. Chagla, Edul Bharucha, F. E. Devitre, Jimmy Avasia, Karl Tamboly, Yugandara Khanwilkar & Rashna Dastoor of M/s. Dastur Dadhich & Kalambi.

    The credit goes to the legal team for fighting their hearts out and to the two stalwarts Mr. Homi Khushrokhan & Mr. Jamshed Kanga for leading from the front.

    AHURA MAZDA NEVER FAILS.

    KHSHNAOTHRA AHURAHE MAZDAO.

  • R.Kayani.

    kerssie wadia 12 March 2011 at 12:01 am #

    “Hope the BPP will now realize that we do not live in a banana republic.”
    WHAT BANANA REPUBLIC U TALKING ABOUT. IT RASNAS REICH, (Sachet Sized)

  • Rathestar.

    DSV is absolutely right in saying that ‘, the settlers did not know that after 125 years parsis will have a different frame of mind, will not stand united ………..’ The conditions 125 years ago or 300 years ago were different. That is precisely what is being emphasized. There were birds of prey to make system of corpse disposal more or less effective. Now when conditions have got altered due to factors beyond the control of an average Parsee, can we cling on to the outdated and ineffective custom? Should we not provide an alternative without depriving those who are comfortable with the out dated custom?

  • Phiroze

    boman, my post of 7 th March was addressed to you and not supposedly. just to put things in proper perspective this judgement is not anti Parsi as it speaks only on the rights or powers of the bpp to ban any priests. If you have read the repots in TOI as pointed out by ratan unwalla above the judgement makes it very clear that the actions of these priests should be “in accord with the tenets of the religion and for a memeber of the community”. This is very much pro Parsi. Hope this does not spoil your little gangs paper victory party 😉 May Ahura Mazda bless all of you with wisdom and rationality and never fail the PARSIS. ATHA ZAMYAT YATHA AFRINAMI

  • Ervad Khushroo Madon

    MY SINCERE THANKS TO DADAR AHURMAZDA,TO PROPHET ZARTHUSTRA..
    My sincere gratitude to the legal team for putting up the case so well.MILLION THANKS TO THEM.

    Our side was represented by Senior Advocate I. M. Chagla, Edul Bharucha, F. E. Devitre, Jimmy Avasia, Karl Tamboly, Yugandara Khanwilkar & Rashna Dastoor of M/s. Dastur Dadhich & Kalambi.,their assistants and staff.THEY ALL DID ABSOLUTELY FREE OF CHARGE thereby saving our lakhs of rupees(or even crores) which unfortunatly BPP has spent for their Lawyers.

    The credit goes to the legal team for fighting their hearts out and to the two stalwarts Mr. Homi Khushrokhan & Mr. Jamshed Kanga for leading from the front. MILLION THANKS TO THEM ALSO.
    Also my gratitude to other five petitioners Mr.Andhyarujina,Dr.R.Soonawala,Ms.A.Aga,Ms.D.Variava and late Dr. Keki Grant.
    My sincere thanks to ARZ,AIMZ,AZA ,ZTFI ,WZO,SBBS,ZOROASTRIAN COLLEGE,MAZDAYASNI MONESTREE,PARSI KHABAR, etc. for their support all through out.
    To thank, the list is endless.To thousands of my supporters I thank them profusely.Sorry I cannot personally and individually thank each and every one of them.I am sorry if I have missed any important person/association to thank.
    I am always at your service.Please call me any time on my phone nos.23698207,66641640,9820170794 or my e mail id. khushroomadon@gmail.com or falijimmy@hotmail.com
    Ofcourse I am available all 24 hours of the day.
    MAY GOD BLESS ALL OUR WELLWISHERS AND LETS HAVE PEACE IN OUR COMMUNITY.
    AHURA MAZDA NEVER FAILS.

    KHSHNAOTHRA AHURAHE MAZDAO.

  • Behroze.

    The correspondent DSV is right in the sense that many things have changed due to passage of time which the original settlors of Trust Deed could not have foreseen. One outstanding example is diappearance of Birds at the Towers rendering the age old custom to collapse. An alternative or at least an option is absolutely overdue.
    True, once again when DSV says that current set of Priests question the wisdom of of forefathers. Outstanding example of this is the Rev Dastur Jamaspi who performed initiation of daughter in law of Tata family and now his own grandson frowns at this very thought. You are right Mr/Ms. DSV, you have hit the nail on the head.
    Congrats.Looking forward to your active participation in future.

  • BOMAN.

    To,
    Phiroze,
    Of course the judgment is not anti Parsee. Where have I said so.? Who says it is.? Actually, If persons go in for an Appeal, they certainly will be against the overall community.
    It is your prejudiced mind that assumes that any person who disagrees with you is Anti Parsee. And it is this inherent mentality that causes you to enter into endless arguments with others like Barak, Farzana, Dordi , Z.Z. and others apart from me.

  • Homi Dalal

    Har kar Jitnewale ko Khusro Madon Kahetey hai
    Dosrey ki Jeet ko Apni Kahne walo ko Phiroze Kahete hai ha ha ha

  • Phiroze

    Boman,
    All those who advocate conversion, acceptance or those like Homi Dalal who talk of demolishing the Towers of silence like the Babri Masjid but run and hide behind women when asked to come face to face are anti-parsi.

  • Phiroze

    Boman, I can live with disagreements. But I cannot be a mute spectator when you and the others you mention try to spread wrong information or engage in nefarious activities against our community. Homi Dalal wants to demolish the towers of silence and writes dialogues from Dabang to impress the ladies but when challenged to a face to face dialogue runs and hides behind the same ladies. Let me know if anyone wants his home address and contact details.

  • Barak Aga

    .
    What do the Trust Deeds state about “Dongerwadi”?

    If the Trust Deeds state that the Dongerwadi lands are to be used solely for the purpose of disposal of the dead by exposure to the elements and carrion-eating birds, then in the absence of vultures, the objects of the trust are not being met.

    Is burial of corpses in the precincts of the Dokhmas, permitted by the Trust Deed? If not, then this practice too is a violation of the objects of the trust.

    Perhaps this issue too can be taken before the courts of law.

  • Contradhongi

    Phiroze.
    Since you have stated that ‘This is very much pro Parsi.” I agree with you. You ought to congratulate the petitioners and ask WAPIZ to celebrate this victory with another separate DHAMAKA.. and felicitate the Legal Team of the petitioners and the Intervenors.That will be the sign of a true Parsee Zoroastrian.

  • I sincerely wish the BPP files an appeal against this verdict in the Supreme Court, so that a final nail can be hammered by the sensible Parsees into the proverbial coffin.

    AHURA MAZDA NEVER FAILS.
    KHSNAOTHRA AHURAHE MAZDAO.

  • Homi Dalal

    Dear Phiroze,
    Why you are SO upset whenever I put filmi dialogue?’ ARE YOU not happy with Javed Akhter’s dialogue? You want me to meet face to face . Come on come to my house with your family, have beer & Dhankakh & sweet dish. Or atleast invite me to your house at 669 , Katrak Road. Dadar.

    ATHITHI AB TUM KAB AAOGE YA MUJE BULAOGE. ( name of Forth coming movie)

    NAAM HOMI HAI MERA SAB PE NAZAR RAKHTA HOO

  • Phiroze

    Barak, not so fast. “exposure to the natural elements and carrion eating birds and animals” is as per the tenets of the religion from which flows the objects of the trust. since the natural elements, being divine grace, are everlasting and there are carrion birds/animals other than the vulture the object sof the trust are fully secured.

  • Piloo

    Winners or losers,loss of face is inconsequential. What about the loss in terms of Legal Fees paid by B.P.P. from Charity Funds?. I am one with those who want the Trustees to bear the cost of litigation inasmuch at was the result of a problem/issue of their own making. There has got to be basic accountability since this is a Charity Trust.
    Common Parsis must act in unison and bring these autocrats to book by making them pay for their misadventure.

  • Barak Aga

    .
    Dear Mr. Phiroze,

    I believe the tenets of the religion are skewed in favour of a speedy and very dignified disposal of the corpse.

    If as you state, carrion eating birds / animals are around, then where is the need for an aviary?
    Why was a proposal to start and aviary mooted?
    Why are solar panels installed?
    What about the Dhun Baria video CD?

    Some years ago, the Jamé Jamshed carried an article / letter to the editor on a cremation pyre at the towers of silence, which had gone out of control. It was mentioned that the flames leapt very high.

  • Homi Dalal

    The publication of Landmark judgment of Mumbai HC. against BPP has appeared in major national dailies like Indian Express and Times of India and that has made all other communities in India aware of state of affairs within our tiny community Yesterday I happened to read the news in a Marathi daily PUDHARI . Firstly was it prudent on the part of BPP to issue such Fatwa banning two priests. Both of them were offering praying since more than a decade and it appears that Fatwa was issued just to please caprice of two Trustees owing allegiance to a reactionary Organisation viz WAPIZ. And get a pat on their backs from so called High Priests known for double standards.. Since one of the banned priest did not want to challenge the Fatwa for the reasons known to him only, it was left for one individual priest to contest for his legitimate rights. In fact one of the Fire Temples managed by B.P.P. and located in Fort is a fire temple for name sake and cannot make two ends meet and so depends on income from Sale of water from Water Tankers. The plausible reason why the Trustees are allowing it to exist is that in future the land prices will go up further , considering that it is in Central business district and in future there will be no more public spirited Parsees left to contest the Trustees who may sell it away for a song in an underhand deal.

    Coming back to the Fatwa, what would have been the financial cost besides the loss of man-hours in defending this whimsical Resolution. This is a valid question which every beneficiary of the Trust would be eager to know . It was media’s report that Rs 26 lacs was the cost of the first stage , where – BPP was successful when the matter was to be taken up in the Originating Summons. Thereafter in the current case there were minimum six to seven hearings before the judgment was delivered. God alone know how much amount of community fund wasted totally to satiate the egos of some Trustees and the Fruit juice concentrate emperor of Amdavad.

    The Judgment is landmark and there is not a single loophole is left for BPP and WAPIZ to appeal in the case. Since it is a judgment of a Bench and since no loophole is left. would or rather should the Trustees contemplate an Appeal and squander further funds. If the Appeal is held as not maintainable, what would be the answer to the community that elected them as Trustees? Loss of face is embarrassing for those who put on an appearance of being wise but what about further loss of face?

    If despite these writings on the wall, should these Trustees attempt to try their luck in S.C. then would they not be digging their graves?

    These same trustees who must have spent minimum amount of Rs2 crores or more on this one issue and yet had the audacity to say that they could not comply with Order of Charity Commissioner for Audit of Accounts for previous ten years as that would be a drain on finances of a Charity Trust!. Now community doubts the bonafides of this contention to avoid Audit on plea of “wastage of, Trust funds’ and considers it specious just to prevent likely discovery of skeletons in their cupboards . One Parsi has written on Face book that there are not only skeletons in their cupboards but they have grave yards in the gardens.

    I am sure BPP will keep their election’s promise and let community know how much this case which they lost costs to BPP.

    Mr. Noshir Dadrawalas repeated the following plea , may prove to be right if Trustees fail to account the expenditure.

    In view of the above it is laughable reading Mr Mehta’s false & hollow election promise once again on his website http://www.dinshawmehta.com/vision.htm:

    “The BPP will function in an open and transparent manner with every member of the community having a Right to Information.” Forget, “every member of the community, Mr Mehta even denies the right of basic information to his own colleague on the Board.

    Lastly,Mumbai Parsee Punchayet is attempting to project itself as an apex body of Parsees and is trying to poke its nose in a suit of an inter married lady of Valsad. The Amdavadi ’emperor’ is talking of Affidavits of High Priests without understanding that even the contents of Affidavits are subject to cross examination and how many Priests have a clear conscience and more importantly a record of not being “pendulums” to withstand such a grueling cross examination?
    More ridicule is to follow????

  • Rathestar.

    Barak,
    You are wasting your time arguing with a person with a closed mind. I have decided not to reply his posts. You know we all are learning new things from
    self taught ornithologist (!) that Peacocks, peahens and parrots are carrion birds.!!! No wonder our community members are subject of comic characters in Hindi Films. SOME PERSONS JUST DO NOT KNOW WHEN NOT TO OPEN THEIR MOUTHS OR USE THEIR KEY BOARDS.

  • Phiroze

    Homi Dalal, or is it homee, what took you so long to invite me to Sushil, Arthur Bunder Road, Colaba. Afterall I had extended the invitation to you in January. What kind of guest are you? You don’t mention the address, time or date.
    I don’t mind the filmy dialogue, you talk of demolishing the dokhmas when you would have difficulty in breaking a roasted papad. This is what all at the gymkhana had to say when they saw your photo with your matrix dialogue.

  • Phiroze

    Barak, the aviary is for the vultures. Solar panels are to aid the natural elements in the absence of vultures. The CD was doctored and please give reference of the Jame report seems a rumour. I thought you had learn’t your lesson about the media and internet.

  • Phiroze

    Homee just a few comments even if you mind,
    Madon did not file the contest for his legitimate rights on his own.
    Since tu sab ki khabar rakhta hai why do you think Mirza filed the affidavit of no contest.
    Your contention on the agiary is very vague and implausible. Do you have any workable alternative besides making it a tourist spot and charging entry fees.
    have you read the trust deed and the judgement in toto to comment about no loop holes left for appeal.
    Are you not contradicting yourself when on one hand you question the legal expense in this case and also want them to spend for unnecessary reaudit.

  • Shapur Kakroo

    Let the BPP appeal to the Honorable Supreme Court.

    Let us get a final Judgement.

    As Mr.Kerssie Wadia has aptly stated above on 15 March 2011, let us “hammer a final nail into the proverbial coffin”.

    Let us finally tell the trustees of the BPP that they cannot act like dictators.

  • Homi Dalal

    Dear Phiroze,

    These questions cannot be discuss & argued on net. Why don’t you come to my house. You have already have my address . WHY you are hesitating to come with your family. Don’t worry I am not going to hammer you. I am an old man.

    SORRY ONCE AGAIN A FILMY DIALOGUE–AADAT SE MUJBOOR.

    HUM TO MEHMAN KO BHAGWAN SAMJTE HAI. KUDRAT KA BHI KYA KARISHMA HAI KI MERE GHAR ME JO HAJAM ATTA HAI USKA BHI NAM BHAGWAN HAI.–KOI SAMJA NA SAKA YEH MEHFIL YEH DUNIYA KYA HAI? WAH USTAD WAH–KYA SAYARI HAI.

    I feel that you are very serous man. Laugh my son laugh. Life is to short. Laugh & the whole world will laugh with you.

    Kindly notify me date & time so that you don’t have to go back. I will also instruct my watchman to let you in.

    Madon did not file the case since he did not care for such fatwas. He earns more than you & me put together. Mirza can only answer your questions what arm twisting tactics were used?

    Please do let the friends know his answers. I am also eager to know for his somersault.

    WISHING YOU & YOUR FAMILY A HAPPY NAVROZ.

  • Phiroze

    Homee, me and my friends laugh everytime we revisit your dialogue on the matrix. We thank you for sparing us the hammering.
    Why does Madon stay in the house meant for poor and needy mobeds if he earns much more then both of us?
    Besides this case was filed against the BPP so the trustees have been forced to spend money to defend themselves.
    Let me know your telephone number so that I can notify you when me and my friends can have a beer with you.

    WISHING YOU AND YOUR FAMILY HAPPY NAVROZ

  • Farsak.Ashli.

    Homee bawa, though I do not know you personally, I advice you to please learn to ignore those who are ‘experts’ in confusing issues. It is in their veins to fool the gullible and they have succeeded in the past and expect it to be ‘fruitful’ at all times in future. If I were you, my reply to this omnipresent Phiroze (who is fond of reading his own name on this portal every day, possibly for publicity) would be:
    —Every suit has a cause of action.HAD THE B.P.P. BEEN MORE CIRCUMSPECT AND HAD THE CURRENT TRUSTEES THE MATURITY LEVEL OF PAST TRUSTEES, THEY WOULD HAVE THOUGHT TWICE BEFORE ISSUING THEIR FATWA, WHICH IS THE GENESIS OF THE SUIT WHICH LIKES OF PHIROZE WANT TO PORTRAY AS BEING “FORCED TO SPEND MONEY TO DEFEND THEMSELVES”
    THIS IS AKIN TO A PERSON BREACHING THE LAW OF THE LAND AND SQUANDERING COMMUNITY FUNDS TO “DEFEND” A LOST CAUSE. TO THEM CONCEPT OF ACCOUNTABILITY IS UNKNOWN
    AT TIMES, I AM AMUSED TO READ THE OVERCONFIDENCE OF A COUPLE OF PERSONS HERE OF THEIR ABILITY TO DELIBERATELY CONFOUND ISSUES AND PORTRAY INJURED INNOCENCE. PERHAPS THAT IS WHAT THEY LEARNT AS A PART OF PARSIPANU. WHAT LEVEL OF MANASHNI,GAVASHNI AND KUNASHNI?
    Rest up to you Homee.

  • Homi Dalal

    Dear Farsak,
    Thanks for the advice. It is stupid to think that case was filed just to forced the trustees to defend & waste Trust money.

    Yes I think I must follow your advice. I am not going to be provoked which he is trying since long.

    God bless you
    Homee

  • Phiroze

    Homee dalal, farsak, barak, farzana, rathestar zz and others of his matrix

    Hope you have read page 16 of yesterday’s Jame weekly. For those who have not here it is:

    The supreme Court of India has defined the protection under the Constitution of India granted to a religious community or denimination thus” A community under Art 26, and its members under Art 25, have the right to ensure its existance by maintaining discipline and ensuring adherance to its tenets and practices by such suitable action like excommunication of those who deny the fundamental basis of the religion”

    Thus if the tenets of the a religion lay down that certain rites and ceremonies are to be performed in a particular manner, no outside authority has any right to say these are not essential parts of religion and it is NOT open to the secular authority to restrict or prohibit them in any manner…..

    Thus the BPP should file a review petition or approach the Supreme court for relief.

  • Kanga

    Phiroze, Are you not contradicting yourself now when you opine that BPP should go in Appeal whereas in your own message of the 14th inst you have stated and reproduced here “this judgement is not anti Parsi as it speaks only on the rights or powers of the bpp to ban any priests. If you have read the reprots in TOI as pointed out by ratan unwalla above the judgment makes it very clear that the actions of these priests should be “in accord with the tenets of the religion and for a member of the community”. This is very much pro Parsi. Hope this does not spoil your little gangs paper victory part”
    If according to you as on the 14th March the verdict was pro Parsee and now by going in Appeal will you NOT become Anti Parsee , right? At least remain consistent for one month and not change your ‘views’ in a fortnight.

  • Kanga.

    Phiroze, take note that all your pompous views expressed here are documented in my P.C. so that your contradictions and somersaults, which can be an envy of any athlete can be reproduced to show your inherent contradictions or shall we say,fickleness of mind.

  • Icchaporia.

    @Kanga.
    Only the Editor of this portal can throw light if the Mr. Phiroze of 28th April is a different boarder than one Phiroze who posted his views on the 14th instant, though prima facie it looks impossible.
    Even if he states that he has merely reproduced the the relevant para of an article in Jame,one needs to observe the end of inverted commas. The last line of the post of 28th apparently is the suggestion from Phiroze who must learn to contribute his mite towards legal charges. Parsees always take free ‘lunches’ for granted. Whose grandfather’s Divaly?

  • Phiroze

    kanga / Icchaporia,

    I am the same Phiroze and still maintain that the verdict was pro Parsi as far as the usage of the Doongerwadi for the the disposal of a dead body as per the tenets and for a member of the community.
    As per the article now the BPP can appeal or go to the Supreme court to overturn the verdict on their powers to defrock and excommunicate Madon Moose and all other Anti Parsis who want coversion, acceptance or usage of Doonerwadi for cremation or as Icchaporia says “Wants free lunch” Aaitu joyech!!!!! Build your own clubs and crematoria

  • Homi Dalal

    Dear Friends
    The following article appeared on Parsi Tari Arsi which is penned by Mr. Berjis Desai, a solicitor by profession, & known to the community.

    ORTHODOXY SUFFERS AN EPOCH MAKING REVERSE

    Khojeste Mistree has rendered splendid service to the liberal cause. By bringing about this judgment, which trust us, is as important if not more, than Petit v. Jeejibhoy and Bella v. Saklat, he has brought the entire edifice of orthodoxy crashing down.

    The ban on the so-called renegade priests has been struck down by the Bombay High Court. While striking down this ban, the observations made by the Court are even more devastating for the orthodox cause. (SEE BOX).

    Undoubtedly, the BPP will file a SLP (appeal) before the Supreme Court. Considering that almost 95% SLPs are dismissed, and having regard to the backdrop of this matter, our guess is that the chances of BPP succeeding are minimal. Even though the BPP is aware of this, they will nevertheless appeal.

    Heady with their victories over AZA, the BPP, like an over complacent boxer, has received a sucker punch right on the solar plexus. For this unmitigated disaster, they have to blame themselves.

    To begin with, the ban was a bad idea. This column had called it banal, idiotic and unnecessary. However, we had termed the legal action initiated against the ban by Jamsheed Kanga and Homi Khushrokhan as being without much legal merit and akin to making an old lady cross a street which she was not too keen to cross. Sure enough, one of the banned priests, Mirza, said that he was not interested in challenging the ban. As predicted, the initial legal challenge did not succeed.

    However, the BPP does not know how to gracefully digest its legal success and began gloating over it, rather obscenely. In the process, they managed to wake up many an indifferent liberal to join the battle. After coming to learn who the new intervenors were, we had foreseen that the odds were steadily mounting against the BPP.

    The WAPIZ roughnecks, who edit the WAPIZ Page in a daily newspaper managed to launch scurrilous attacks on all and sundry including the liberal camp’s Senior Counsel, Iqbal Chagla. The BPP Review then added some further insinuations against the intervenors. All these antics upset the Judges no end. There are serious strictures passed against the trustees. A SLP becomes all that more difficult.

    The liberals skillfully managed to portray the BPP as the Parsi Taliban terrorizing the community into meek submission and trampling upon the rights of whoever dared to oppose them.

    All these WAPIZ self-goals made Chairman Dinshaw Mehta realize (the shrewd and seasoned litigant that he is) that legal merits of the BPP case were taking a back seat. It was too late, however, to make amends and WAPIZ preferred to ignore hints from the Court to end this litigation and compromise.

    The result was a resounding victory for the liberals and a dozen eggs on WAPIZ face. Unfortunately for the orthodox (and probability demanded a slice of overdue good luck for the reformists), the judgment goes far beyond invalidating the silly ban and will have far reaching consequences for all Agiary trusts. We can hear ARZ, AIMZA and many a liberal sing in delight. The judgment contains observations which will open a Pandora’s box on each and every issue which the orthodox cherish. Next week, we shall tell you what this judgment will do for the liberal cause.

    If the SLP is dismissed, this judgment will be good law for all times. Trying to ban Khushru Madon was like squeezing a pimple, thought WAPIZ and Mehta. In the process, they have managed to slice their jugular and how!

    This judgment will embolden the hitherto slumbering AIMZ ladies to test the proposition of equal rights for their children ‘Cremate-ni-Bungli’ will get a great boost too.

    The irony, is, that perhaps the BPP did not have such a bad legal case. Every trust has a right to decide which service provider it wants. This proposition has been rubbished by the Court. Sometimes bad antics in Court spoil a good legal case. As they say, bad facts make bad law.

    In recent times, WAPIZ had managed to cultivate a reputation for being somewhat of a sensible mainstream orthodox group, unlike the Lunatic Fringe. However, a rush of blue blood to their limited intelligence, a chapter borrowed from their President and his loutish antics, and all this made a heady cocktail for a complete legal disaster. A strategist like Mehta must be lamenting in private about the utter idiocy of his political partners.

  • Homi Dalal

    Dear Friends,
    This will clear all the doubts. It is for the benefit of those who do not read Bombay Samachar. It is also for the benefit of those who twist & turn the judgement to suit their own agenda

    EXTRACTS FROM THE JUDGMENT

    “We have adverted to these passages from the judgments of the Division Bench to emphasize the principle which succeeding generations of Judges must bear in mind when they consider a decision rendered prior to independence before the enforcement of the Constitution. We respect and have great deference for the learning wisdom and erudition that went into the judgment of the Division Bench in Sir Dinshaw Manekji Petit’s case. But we must hasten to add that the judgment must be understood in the context of the social milieu of the age in which it was written. The guarantees of equality, liberty, freedom and dignity which the Constitution has enacted have over the last sixty years and more changed in fundamental ways the face of Indian Society and the polity. As Judges of the Constitutional Court that the High Court is, we must straddle a careful path – a path which is deferential to precedent but conscious of the Constitutional ethos and the evolving face of Indian Society.”

    “Having carefully analysed the Deed of Trust, we do not find that there is any provision therein that would empower the trustees to prevent a duly ordained Zoroastrian Priest from performing the obsequial rites so long as the rights are rendered for a member of the Parsi Community professing the Zoroastrian religion and the rites and ceremonies accord with the tenets of the faith. The trustees cannot exert a power to exclude where these conditions are fulfilled.”

    “The Court would not be justified in conferring upon the trustees a power to exclude a duly ordained Zoroastrian Priest from performing obsequial ceremonies for a Parsi Zoroastrian in accordance with the religious rites and ceremonies of the faith. Such a power has not been conferred upon them by the Deed of Trust. Reading any such power into the Deed of Trust in the absence of explicit provision or, at any rate one which arises by necessary implication, would be impermissible. Worse still it is likely to be subject to grave abuse.”

    “The Appellants before the Court and the Intervenors who have supported them have submitted before the Court that persons who opt for cremation or for other forms of disposal of dead bodies have a perspective based upon contemporary needs and concerns. They do not forsake the faith by laying bare a view point. To place a perspective is not to destroy a faith. The cohesiveness of a faith is maintained by dialogue not division. The impassioned plea of the Appellants even before this Court for a recourse to reason has only been met with reprisals – reprisals against the Appellants, the intervenors and their Counsel. No vultures, it has been submitted by the Appellants, are available any more at the Towers of Silence and the bodies lie purified until eventually they are disposed of in a mass grave.”

    “To this the Appellants submit that despite the solar panels, it is only the bodily fluids that evaporate while the flesh and the organs are left in tact in a charred state.”

    “The trustees have no power either to ordain a priest or to divest the priest of the entitlement which follows upon being ordained.”

    “The Appellants have been supported in the appeal by five Intervenors:

    1. Dr. Keki Byramji Grant

    2. Mr. Tehmtan R. Andhyarujina

    3. Dr. Rustom P. Soonawala

    4. Mrs. Dilnavaz Variava

    5. Mrs. Anu Aga

    Each of them has a distinguished record of service to the nation in the walks of life that their paths have travelled. The Respondents have launched upon an unfortunate tirade against these members of the Parsi Zoroastrian community. Even the Counsel appearing on behalf of the Appellants and the Intervenors have not been spared. We record our disapproval to the innuendos leveled against a distinguished former Judge of this Court and the Supreme Court. Besides being unfounded, they have been leveled without a sense of responsibility. Out of a concern for judicial propriety, we have considered it proper not to advert to all the details of the unseemly attacks on the Appellants, the intervenors and Senior Counsel in this judgment. Conferring upon the trustees such broad powers of exclusion (even though they have no such power in the Deed of Trust) would result in a grave affront to basic human rights and individual dignity. Life and death, we believe often lie beyond human choice. The trustees must be left to govern in the secular province that the Trust Deed has created for them. The trustees cannot arrogate powers to themselves in a mistaken belief that they are custodians of the religion. Religion and faith reside in the hearts of the multitude for whom devotion to the faith is a matter of conscience protected by Article 25 of the Constitution. That sense of faith and commitment to a religion as profound in its philosophy as the Zoroastrian faith cannot be subverted by the trustees. At least the Court cannot be a party to encouraging religious obscurantism

  • Homi Dalal

    If anyone is interested in full judgement of 60 pages please feel free to ask–giving their e mail id. I will be happy to forward the same.

  • Phiroze

    Homee Dalal,

    The trust deed may not give the powers but Article 25 and 26 of the constitution do. The appeal be filed or Supreme court should be approached at the earliest

  • Homi Dalal

    Dear Phiroze,

    Do you think that counsels for the defendant were ignorant about these sections. Do you know that in appeal nothing new can be added? Yes they will file the appeal -it is their constitutional right but whether it will be admitted or not is a million $ question? Even if it is admitted what will be the outcome–nobody is sure of. Are you sure of the success? One thing is sure that BPP is going to spend in lacs just for one priest. They have already wasted in crores.

  • Phiroze

    Dear Homee,

    Having read the 60 pages judgement, nowhere has this right under these sections is mentioned. If not an appeal then this should be challenged in the Supreme Court. Yes there will be success and it will put an end to the nefarious activities of the so called reformists. The BPP is spending lacs on giving housing to this renegade priest. What are a few crores if it ensures the community’s survival?

  • Zerxes.

    “What are a few crores if it ensures the community’s survival?”
    One can talk like this so long as he or she does not have to bear the burden of costs. My simple question to such ‘intellectuals’ is that on one side you claimed that Trust Deed was sacrosanct. Does this Trust Deed enables the Trustees for throwing money in wasteful litigation.
    DO NOT TREAT CHARITABLE FUNDS LEFT BY EARLIER GENERATIONS AS YOUR OWN GREAT GRAND FATHERS PROPERTY.

  • KANGA.

    Phiroze here says that the BPP is spending lacs on giving housing to this renegade priest. What are a few crores if it ensures the community’s survival?
    What about one ‘High’ Priest who performed conversion of an Eighty year old man for favour of flat and monthly dole resides in a BPP managed (Wadia) Colony. WHAT IS THE DIFFERENCE?
    How litigation will ‘help’ survival of the Community?. Population figures speak for themselves.

  • Phiroze

    Zerxes / Kanga, this burden of litigation was put on the BPP. Ask this question to Kanga & Co. Today it may cost a few crores. After five years it will be tens of crores. SC will have to overturn this verdict under Art 25 & 26 of the constitution.

    The renegade priest enjoys subsidised housing from the BPP while his son is studying in London. Where did this money come from? The same education is available in India too.

  • KANGA.

    Mr. Phiroze. You seem to constantly deviate from issues thinking that you are very smart. My question was “..What about one ‘High’ Priest who performed conversion of an Eighty year old man for favour of flat and monthly dole resides in a BPP managed (Wadia) Colony. WHAT IS THE DIFFERENCE?
    How litigation will ‘help’ survival of the Community?”

    But persons like you are bent on causing embarassment to those whom you call “High Priests” as if there are levels beyond Navar & Martab.
    There are many high earning professionals staying in Charity Baugs. And who finances foreign jaunts of these self labelled high Priests? Such inconvenient questions have to be repeated much to the embarassment of these HIGH priests, thanks to persons like you who believe that dual principles can be practiced without being questioned.

  • Zerxes.

    @Kanga,
    The problem with men like Phiroze is that they assume that they can take others for a ride for all times to come. Such persons try to create a hen and egg riddle assuming the reader to be naive. The cause of action of Originating Summons was the Fatwa. Was this fatwa at all necessary. Many well meaning traditionalists too have felt that the two priests could have been prevented from working in Godavara and Jokhi Agiaries just by instructing the concerned Panthakies. But the reason behind the fatwa were manifestly to create a fear factor among other mobeds to deter them from following their conscience.The burden of litigation was not put on BPP but it was self created problem.

  • Phiroze

    Kanga, does two wrong make one right? Litigation now will once and for all settle the issue of Anti Parsis who work against the community from within. The questions have to be asked no matter who is involved and even if embarassment is caused to anyone.
    Zerxes, such fatwas are neccessary when the very survival of the community is at stake. All those who do not agree with the community are free to leave. It will be money well spent.

  • Rustom Adi Havewalla

    THIS IS SO UNFORTUNATE. This site which was meant to invite the reactions of the Members of the community has been MISUSED by the some people. Instead of giving their views, they have started SHOWING OFF by writing to each other and commenting on the views of others! It is so unfortunate that by trying to show off their knowledge and superiority, they are invariably exposing their ignorance.

    Please try and understand:-

    When God Himself waits till the End of Our Time to judge us, why are you and I in a hurry?

    Just put down your comments, your views and your suggestions. That’s all. Why is it necessary for you to run after others?

    DO YOU REALLY THINK THAT WE CAN PROVE OUR SUPERIORITY OVER OTHERS BY RUNNING THEM DOWN?

    Please wake up. This is ruining the community and the worst is that IT IS RUINING YOUR OWN SELVES. WHY LIVE LIFE WITH HEARTBURNS INSTEAD OF ENJOYMENT AND HAPPINESS?

    In our country, India, the enormous population is the root of all Problems.

    Our community is BLESSED! We are small in number. Yet, we are so rich in our culture, our customs, our sanskars and our wealth too. A higher number can never help improve any community or nation. A higher number only results in a bigger army and police force.

    Our community is small. So what? Why not make it the best of all the communities.

    PLS. LET GOD DO HIS OWN WORK. We are still not qualified for that job.

  • Rustom Adi Havewalla

    There are too many letters written by Kanga. Is he Jamsheed Kanga?

    I don’t understand why he indulges in attacking people and then clarifying.

    I hope people appreciate that this site is meant for giving your comments or your opinions.

    This site is not meant for writing letters to each other to prove that we, and we alone are right.

    I hope common sense prevails and people write to the point.

    All the best.

  • Rustom Adi Havewalla

    There are too many letters written by Kanga. Is he Jamsheed Kanga?

    I don’t understand why he indulges in attacking people and then clarifying.

    I hope people appreciate that this site is meant for giving your comments or your opinions.

    This site is not meant for writing letters to each other to prove that we, and we alone are right.

    I hope common sense prevails and people write to the point.

    All the best.

  • Rathestar.

    In fact far too many messages were being posted by one named Phiroze. As far as I can recall, one Kanga has hardly posted half a dozen posts.You can call for statistics or get them from SEARCH Box here.
    I am told there is a Kangawad and all residents there have a common surname of Kanga. Is Havewalla assuming that there is only one solitary Kanga?

  • Rathestar.

    In fact far too many messages were being posted by one named Phiroze. As far as I can recall, one Kanga has hardly posted half a dozen posts.You can call for statistics or get them from SEARCH Box here.
    I am told there is a Kangawad and all residents there have a common surname of Kanga. Is Havewalla assuming that there is only one solitary Kanga?

  • Barak Aga

    This news article should have been captioned, “HC UPHOLDS ZOROASTRIAN VIEW IN PARSI COMMUNITY”.

    The self-appointed High Priests and the BPP are caught in a cleft-stick on this issue.
    This issue throws up a conflict between the BPP and the self-appointed High Priests.

    Who are the religious leaders of the “Parsis”? The BPP or the priests?
    If the priests claim to be the religious leaders of the community, how is it that the BPP jumped the gun, arrogated ecclesiastical powers to itself, and issued an edict on a religious issue?

  • Barak Aga

    This news article should have been captioned, “HC UPHOLDS ZOROASTRIAN VIEW IN PARSI COMMUNITY”.

    The self-appointed High Priests and the BPP are caught in a cleft-stick on this issue.
    This issue throws up a conflict between the BPP and the self-appointed High Priests.

    Who are the religious leaders of the “Parsis”? The BPP or the priests?
    If the priests claim to be the religious leaders of the community, how is it that the BPP jumped the gun, arrogated ecclesiastical powers to itself, and issued an edict on a religious issue?